Moron Motorists #3

[find_bruce]

Gotta love the Bourke Rd cycleway aka truck parking & loading zone

Everyday there is someone parked in it!

Personally I hate the bus stops with the blind chicanes where the footpath merges into the cycle lane... Let your concentration lapse at these points and you are either taking out a pedestrian or having a head on with an oncoming rider.

Is there a fast way of reporting it? I know that COS is keen to clamp down on that when it can

I have had no joy ringing up CoS rangers on 02 9265 9333. Snap send solve is a useful app in that it sends them a photo & location, but in my experience council rangers do not respond within 1/2 day, which usually means that the offender has moved on. Thus far I have been unable to get any council to act on photographic evidence, perhaps others have had better luck

[human909]

Everyday there is someone parked in it!

Personally I hate the bus stops with the blind chicanes where the footpath merges into the cycle lane... Let your concentration lapse at these points and you are either taking out a pedestrian or having a head on with an oncoming rider.

Is there a fast way of reporting it? I know that COS is keen to clamp down on that when it can

I have had no joy ringing up CoS rangers on 02 9265 9333. Snap send solve is a useful app in that it sends them a photo & location, but in my experience council rangers do not respond within 1/2 day, which usually means that the offender has moved on. Thus far I have been unable to get any council to act on photographic evidence, perhaps others have had better luck

Try emails higher up the chain, because CoS should be caring about this. But it does sound like the rangers CoS rangers don't.

[jasonc]

[Arbuckle23]

If only they had rego and a licence!

[find_bruce]

Try emails higher up the chain, because CoS should be caring about this. But it does sound like the rangers CoS rangers don't.

As I understand it City of Sydney's service standards, like other councils, is to respond within 24 hours, which is effectively useless for almost all parking issues. This is despite the fact that parking fines constitute a significant part of council's revenue

[Scott_C]

Is there a fast way of reporting it? I know that COS is keen to clamp down on that when it can

I have had no joy ringing up CoS rangers on 02 9265 9333. Snap send solve is a useful app in that it sends them a photo & location, but in my experience council rangers do not respond within 1/2 day, which usually means that the offender has moved on. Thus far I have been unable to get any council to act on photographic evidence, perhaps others have had better luck

Try emails higher up the chain, because CoS should be caring about this. But it does sound like the rangers CoS rangers don't.

I'd also recommend presenting it as a safety and liability issue rather than a compliance issue as you are likely to get a more immediate response if you talk about the dangers caused by their failure to keep it clear of illegally parked vehicles and the potential liability if the illegally parked vehicles damage the City's infrastructure and render it unsafe.

[AdelaidePeter]

The sun was in their eyes, so they're excused.

Seriously, they were just lucky that it had happened at a time when other traffic would have been stopped anyway.

[pj]

Hard to see exactly but looks like they momentarily hit the brakes when crossing the line, lucky nobody was still in the intersection!

[bychosis]

Not that it is a free pass, but I wonder if they were trying to time the lights. Saw the opposing yellow, knew the sequence, saw no approaching traffic and just mis-timed the green light. The back wheels were only just across the stop line when lights went green.

[hannos]

Is there a fast way of reporting it? I know that COS is keen to clamp down on that when it can

I figured out it was City of Sydney so, seeing as Clover is all pro-cycling, I went to their website, specifically:

https://online.cityofsydney.nsw.gov.au/ ... galParking

If police can issue traffic infringement notices from pictures, then I do not see why Rangers cannot.

[AdelaidePeter]

Here is an intersection I routinely go through on my commute. I go straight ahead to a path in the parklands on the opposite side of the road. So by design I'm meant to position myself in the bicycle lane. But I rarely do: left turning cars routinely swing right, coming uncomfortably close to me if I am in the bicycle lane. And the left turn arrow is just before the green light, meaning I am usually waiting at the lights while cars turn left past me.

Anyway the reason for posting today: on Monday, two drivers in a row took up most of the whole bicycle lane as they did a left turn. Even though I was entirely in the right lane, I reckon they still managed to broke the 1 metre rule.

[jasonc]

I reckon they still managed to broke the 1 metre rule.

1m law only applies when they are passing on your right....
Good ol West terrace...

[find_bruce]

Is there a fast way of reporting it? I know that COS is keen to clamp down on that when it can

I figured out it was City of Sydney so, seeing as Clover is all pro-cycling, I went to their website, specifically:

https://online.cityofsydney.nsw.gov.au/ ... galParking

If police can issue traffic infringement notices from pictures, then I do not see why Rangers cannot.

I agree with you, but I have yet to see a council comprehend that photographs have been admitted as evidence for more than 100 years.

Let us know how you go

[AdelaidePeter]

I reckon they still managed to broke the 1 metre rule.

1m law only applies when they are passing on your right....
Good ol West terrace...

I don't think you're correct. I did a quick Google and while I can't find the legislation, the "popular guides" like http://mylicence.sa.gov.au/road-rules/cycling-laws simply specify 1 metre (or 1.5 metre if over 60 km/h).

West Terrace bikeway is great, Hindley Street (west of Morphett) is ok, it's just that the bicycle lane at that intersection isn't ideal. But with only so much road width, I'm not sure what a better option is.

[jasonc]

I reckon they still managed to broke the 1 metre rule.

1m law only applies when they are passing on your right....
Good ol West terrace...

I don't think you're correct. I did a quick Google and while I can't find the legislation, the "popular guides" like http://mylicence.sa.gov.au/road-rules/cycling-laws simply specify 1 metre (or 1.5 metre if over 60 km/h).

this is the qld one:
https://www.legislation.qld.gov.au/view ... 4#sec.144A

(3)For subsection (2), the lateral distance is the distance between the following points—

(a)the furthermost point to the left on the driver’s vehicle or any projection from the vehicle (whether or not attached to the vehicle);

(b)the furthermost point to the right on the bicycle, any bicycle trailer towed by the bicycle, the rider or any passenger in or on the trailer.

note my bolding

[AdelaidePeter]

this is the qld one:
https://www.legislation.qld.gov.au/view ... 4#sec.144A

(3)For subsection (2), the lateral distance is the distance between the following points—

(a)the furthermost point to the left on the driver’s vehicle or any projection from the vehicle (whether or not attached to the vehicle);

(b)the furthermost point to the right on the bicycle, any bicycle trailer towed by the bicycle, the rider or any passenger in or on the trailer.

note my bolding

Interesting. I've now found the SA legislation and it uses the same wording https://www.legislation.sa.gov.au/LZ/C/ ... 7.AUTH.PDF . But I wonder if that's actually a fault in the legislation, because the passing rule itself doesn't specify a side. So maybe a court will rule that it "naturally" means 1 metre when passing on the left. It might be one of those things which won't be known until it's challenged in a court of law.

[human909]

Interesting. I've now found the SA legislation and it uses the same wording https://www.legislation.sa.gov.au/LZ/C/ ... 7.AUTH.PDF . But I wonder if that's actually a fault in the legislation, because the passing rule itself doesn't specify a side. So maybe a court will rule that it "naturally" means 1 metre when passing on the left. It might be one of those things which won't be known until it's challenged in a court of law.

It SA wording seems pretty specific to me:

"Despite anything in rule 144, a driver of a motor vehicle driving past to the right of the rider of a bicycle travelling in the same direction as the driver must pass the bicycle at a sufficient distance from the bicycle."

[RobertL]

But with only so much road width, I'm not sure what a better option is.

A better option, and one that is now in the Aust Design Standards for roads (I believe) is to have a protected bike lane on the left in that scenario. You can then have a left-turn lane for vehicles to the right of that (i.e. the middle lane), and a straight-ahead lane on the right.

This means that motor vehicles turning left have to cross over and through the bike lane.

However, you separate the bikes and motor vehicles by having bicycle-specific traffic lights. This means that although motor vehicles have to cross the bike lane to turn left, they are never allowed to do so while bikes are going straight ahead.

[human909]

A better option, and one that is now in the Aust Design Standards for roads (I believe) is to have a protected bike lane on the left in that scenario. You can then have a left-turn lane for vehicles to the right of that (i.e. the middle lane), and a straight-ahead lane on the right.

This means that motor vehicles turning left have to cross over and through the bike lane.

However, you separate the bikes and motor vehicles by having bicycle-specific traffic lights. This means that although motor vehicles have to cross the bike lane to turn left, they are never allowed to do so while bikes are going straight ahead.

That sounds horrible in terms of traffic flow both for motorists and for cyclists. Given it is a poor outcome for motorists it makes it less likely to be implemented and when implemented it means less time in the traffic cycle for cyclist which is a common complaint on Sydney's bidirectional paths


This is a common scenario in Melbourne's cycle friendly areas. It works just fine. Better if you have a motoring public that is aware and considerate of cyclists and even better if the speed limits are low.

A better implementation is to provide bike boxes at the front to allow cyclists to filter safely and then position themselves in a more visible manner. Or possibly even better is to remove the bicycle lane altogether and just provide sharrows and bike box. An unsafe bike lane is worse than none at all.

Good marking, long entry way and bike boxes across both lanes

The start of Royal Parade, a primary route into Melbourne. Look at that width! And yet that bicycle lane carries 35% of private vehicle travel during peak hour!

[jasonc]

Had funny one this morning. Inbound turbot St in Brisbane, cnr of Albert. So I was waiting in line. I was about 5th vehicle. The left lane had lots of cars, so I was in the middle lane. Light goes green, we a take off. I'm doing my best to keep up with traffic. After Edward st and the car park lane, I move to the left. Car behind me then goes full throttle for about 50 to stop behind a bunch of cars at the lights. About 5 seconds later I roll past. Slowing down to have a good look in his window so he knows he's a moron. I beat him past boundary st too

[human909]

Had funny one this morning. Inbound turbot St in Brisbane, cnr of Albert. So I was waiting in line. I was about 5th vehicle. The left lane had lots of cars, so I was in the middle lane. Light goes green, we a take off. I'm doing my best to keep up with traffic. After Edward st and the car park lane, I move to the left. Car behind me then goes full throttle for about 50 to stop behind a bunch of cars at the lights. About 5 seconds later I roll past. Slowing down to have a good look in his window so he knows he's a moron. I beat him past boundary st too

He probably didn't get the hint. Morons will be morons. Those sort of morons only look at the one vehicle in front of them.

It same thing happens to me almost daily as a driver.** I'm not going to speed up to 60kph before that red light 250m down the road with a queue of traffic. I get idiots changing lanes flooring it then braking all the time. Then I trundle up and then still have to wait 20s in the congestion... Of course they think I am the moron for driving so slowly towards a red light.

**Some day hopefully sooner rather than later I'm going to stop being a daily driver and go back to being a daily cyclist. I'm sorry that I'm a cager now. (Commute distance of 40km will need to change.)

[fat and old]

Good marking, long entry way and bike boxes across both lanes

The start of Royal Parade, a primary route into Melbourne. Look at that width! And yet that bicycle lane carries 35% of private vehicle travel during peak hour!

That's because your view is the Moreland side. Look at CO side.

Anyway, I raise with this: Canning St, complete with no hands phone texting inner urban tradies!!

https://www.google.com.au/maps/place/Ca ... 44.9731852

[P!N20]

The start of Royal Parade, a primary route into Melbourne. Look at that width! And yet that bicycle lane carries 35% of private vehicle travel during peak hour!

The pinch point about 20m before that needs some attention. I noticed they moved the bike lane on the south side of Brunswick Rd over a metre or so, for what reason I don't know - once you get to that point there seems to be plenty of room. I was hoping they may have directed bikes down the left side of the traffic island (like many do anyway,) but it hasn't happened yet.

Once you get through that though, Royal Parade TT is on!

[hannos]

It same thing happens to me almost daily as a driver.** I'm not going to speed up to 60kph before that red light 250m down the road with a queue of traffic. I get idiots changing lanes flooring it then braking all the time. Then I trundle up and then still have to wait 20s in the congestion... Of course they think I am the moron for driving so slowly towards a red light.

I saw this all the time when I had to commute to Rhodes in Sydney.
Centenary Drive Roowood. Always a car park.
I'd idle along in 2nd in my (ex) Forester diesel, I'd have 50m to 100m gap to the car in front and have people honking at me. I'd still have to stop behind the car that was 100m in front...

So I didn't reach the speed limit. My average speed for that drive never changed though (roughly 23km/h over 33km)

[human909]

Anyway, I raise with this: Canning St, complete with no hands phone texting inner urban tradies!!

Yes plenty of better infrastructure examples with Canning St and others, I was trying to offer comparable examples.

That's because your view is the Moreland side. Look at CO side.

I'm a bit confused here. I presume you mean Royal Parade and COM? Not a whole lot different in some spots:
https://www.google.com.au/maps/(AT)-37.799 ... 312!8i6656

The pinch point about 20m before that needs some attention.

Pretty much all of Sydney Road needs attention. It is in the hard basket but it is seriously being looked at. I can't say I'm hopeful for a ideal solution in the near term, but expect to see a halfway solution within the next 5 years.
https://www.theage.com.au/national/vict ... 4zu5m.html
https://www.facebook.com/revitalisesydneyrd/

Personally as a confident, alert and agile cyclists I don't mind Sydney Road much at all due to the low speed limit. However I am not your average cyclist, plenty of my female friends hate it, and female cyclists are 'a good indicator species' of safe cycling infrastructure.

Royal Parade TT is on!

So I didn't reach the speed limit. My average speed for that drive never changed though (roughly 23km/h over 33km)

Ouch! The one thing that makes my commute tenable is that my average speed is 60kph. Otherwise I would have never taken the job. (First 5-10minutes is slow and then its 100kph). Of course my average speed is far from the typical commuter especially given my location.