Cyclist Hit Kings Park this morning

cp123
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Re: Cyclist Hit Kings Park this morning

Postby cp123 » Fri Dec 19, 2014 11:08 am

gees that was a badly written piece. maybe it was written by the y8 work experience kid.



And it seems to have been totally preventable. :roll:

crazioldjane
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Re: Cyclist Hit Kings Park this morning

Postby crazioldjane » Fri Dec 19, 2014 3:02 pm

bianchi928 wrote:
crazioldjane wrote: sad and stressful for the criminal driver involved but a life was taken...however for her at the end of the day the penalty won't reflect the crime committed because she, the offender will, as is usual, try to lie their way out of, or try to mitigate it down...
How do you know? Do you know her?

Absolute tradegy but let's get the facts first instead of making generalisations.
we are all entitled to our opinion... you are entitled to your opinion of my opinion...and i am entitled my opinion of your opinion of my opinion....but i am too polite to give it :wink:
" faith is the substance of things hoped for..the evidence of things not seen"

Grev
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Re: Cyclist Hit Kings Park this morning

Postby Grev » Fri Dec 19, 2014 7:08 pm

I hope our legal system operates on due process and evidence, not opinion.

If you go back to the original post the cyclist was described as “believed to be in her 50s” and the driver “estimated to be in her late 20s or early 30s”. If the media do not have facts - they just make it up! I would like to think our legal system does a better job.

Yes, you are entitled to your opinion, but on legal matters such as this, opinions are better directed to redneck radio.

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Aushiker
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Re: Cyclist Hit Kings Park this morning

Postby Aushiker » Fri Dec 19, 2014 7:15 pm

crazioldjane wrote:we are all entitled to our opinion... you are entitled to your opinion of my opinion...and i am entitled my opinion of your opinion of my opinion....but i am too polite to give it :wink:
Actually only within limits ... we have defamation laws for a reason ...

Andrew

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ColinOldnCranky
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Re: Cyclist Hit Kings Park this morning

Postby ColinOldnCranky » Fri Dec 19, 2014 9:08 pm

crazioldjane wrote:
bianchi928 wrote:
crazioldjane wrote: sad and stressful for the criminal driver involved but a life was taken...however for her at the end of the day the penalty won't reflect the crime committed because she, the offender will, as is usual, try to lie their way out of, or try to mitigate it down...
How do you know? Do you know her?

Absolute tradegy but let's get the facts first instead of making generalisations.
we are all entitled to our opinion... you are entitled to your opinion of my opinion...and i am entitled my opinion of your opinion of my opinion....but i am too polite to give it :wink:
The old "I am entitled to my opinion" is one of the most common non-defenses put up and is often an indication of being caught out and not really having a defence.

Bianchi made a fair call, you made a statement on a specific case about a specific person based on... well, based on what? Sterotype? I agree it is a common thing but I would want to have more than that before making such an unequivocal judgement. Here standards of argument tend to be a fair higher than elsewhere. Many like Bianchi will expect you to put up some substance even if he is in agreement with your sentiments. You'll value it in due course if you don't already. :)
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crazioldjane
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Re: Cyclist Hit Kings Park this morning

Postby crazioldjane » Fri Dec 19, 2014 10:20 pm

[/quote] Bianchi made a fair call, you made a statement on a specific case about a specific person based on... well, based on what? Sterotype? I agree it is a common thing but I would want to have more than that before making such an unequivocal judgement. Here standards of argument tend to be a fair higher than elsewhere. Many like Bianchi will expect you to put up some substance even if he is in agreement with your sentiments. You'll value it in due course if you don't already. :) [/quote]


crikey...i'm feeling the heat in here :shock: ...oh hang on its 39 degrees today :D
" faith is the substance of things hoped for..the evidence of things not seen"

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ColinOldnCranky
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Re: Cyclist Hit Kings Park this morning

Postby ColinOldnCranky » Sat Dec 20, 2014 1:34 am

crazioldjane wrote:crikey...i'm feeling the heat in here :shock: ...oh hang on its 39 degrees today :D
I rode home thru it this arvo. The heat was fine. It was the Freo Doctor that buggered me. :(
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eldavo
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Re: Cyclist Hit Kings Park this morning

Postby eldavo » Sat Dec 20, 2014 12:52 pm

It was 37degC Perth while it was 24degC in Hillarys, thanks to the doctor.

On the OT, real shame that someone who was doing great things for their age, including riding, had their life taken for no good reason.
The stats of ~50% of cycle fatalities from rear vehicle collision is the kind of bad odds for being a cyclist on the road.

On return from interview from new job on my new commute path, I was driving behind a car swerving across the road for 3km, 3 traffic light stops.
At the last lights where the car was turning off I looked across and saw she was using knees to steer with a phone in each hand texting. That would explain it... but any one of those swerves could have been a rider taken out.
I was doing recce on the drive for the new cycle commute, despite how neglected tree uprooted and smashed glass littered the path was, I didn't need convincing to take a rough ride and multiple punctures and driveway exiting vehicles as a slightly more options to me near miss, in preference to being another rear collision cycling statistic.

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Aushiker
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Re: Cyclist Hit Kings Park this morning

Postby Aushiker » Mon Jan 12, 2015 9:08 pm

This matter is scheduled to come before the Courts (Magistrate?) tomorrow according to my calendar.

Andrew

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CycleSnail
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Re: Cyclist Hit Kings Park this morning

Postby CycleSnail » Tue Jan 13, 2015 3:08 pm

Aushiker wrote:This matter is scheduled to come before the Courts (Magistrate?) tomorrow according to my calendar.

Andrew

The woman accused of causing the death of renowned Professor Paola Ferroni by allegedly crashing a 4WD into her as she rode her bike in West Perth has made a tearful appearance in court.

Joanne Leigh Lawrence, 41, spoke only to confirm that she understood the charge of dangerous driving causing death on Kings Park Road last November.

She was granted bail, and will return to court in March

The newspaper article is here
https://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/a/259 ... ike-death/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Aushiker
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Re: Cyclist Hit Kings Park this morning

Postby Aushiker » Tue Jan 13, 2015 3:21 pm

CycleSnail wrote:She was granted bail, and will return to court in March
Thanks. If anyone has the actual date it would be appreciated.

Andrew

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Thoglette
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Re: Cyclist Hit Kings Park this morning

Postby Thoglette » Tue Jan 13, 2015 6:10 pm

ABC News http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-01-13/w ... th/6014630" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
until her next court appearance in March.
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cp123
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Re: Cyclist Hit Kings Park this morning

Postby cp123 » Thu Jan 15, 2015 9:43 am

does the driver still hold a valid licence in the meantime...?

Scott_C
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Re: Cyclist Hit Kings Park this morning

Postby Scott_C » Thu Jul 30, 2015 9:36 pm

The woman who ran down Professor Paola Ferroni plead guilty today to dangerous driving causing death.

She remains free on bail ahead of her next court appearance in September.

https://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/wa/a/ ... sts-death/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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Mububban
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Re: Cyclist Hit Kings Park this morning

Postby Mububban » Tue Aug 04, 2015 11:35 am

She hit the rider from behind....how does that happen if you're not distracted by a phone etc???
When you are driving your car, you are not stuck IN traffic - you ARE the traffic!!!

nachoman
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Re: Cyclist Hit Kings Park this morning

Postby nachoman » Tue Aug 04, 2015 12:44 pm

From around the time of the crash:

"Senior Constable Allan Mawdesley said the driver's mobile phone had been seized and that police were looking into the possibility she was using it immediately prior to the incident."

has there been any further confirmation that this was a factor in the accident ?

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ColinOldnCranky
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Re: Cyclist Hit Kings Park this morning

Postby ColinOldnCranky » Thu Aug 06, 2015 7:12 pm

Mububban wrote:She hit the rider from behind....how does that happen if you're not distracted by a phone etc???
My answer (months late I admit) is these things also happened before mobile phones existed. Lots of things can explain it,mostly due to bad driving. (But not absolutely. Equipment failure, medical condition, wasp in cabin, ...)
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AlexHuggs
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Re: Cyclist Hit Kings Park this morning

Postby AlexHuggs » Sat Aug 22, 2015 5:21 pm

ColinOldnCranky wrote:
Mububban wrote:She hit the rider from behind....how does that happen if you're not distracted by a phone etc???
My answer (months late I admit) is these things also happened before mobile phones existed. Lots of things can explain it,mostly due to bad driving. (But not absolutely. Equipment failure, medical condition, wasp in cabin, ...)
Radio... but none as frequent or as insistent/tempting as mobile phones. I hitch a ride with someone who frequently uses a phone while driving - and should know better. But it's always at low speed and unlikely to cause a fatality (and is on the opposite side of the road to the shared path). I'm trying to educate them about Siri and so on. Said person has lost license in the past for speeding.

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Re: Cyclist Hit Kings Park this morning

Postby Scott_C » Thu Nov 26, 2015 4:06 pm

The ABC has an update on the woman who killed Paola Ferroni-

Woman who caused the death of Kings Park cyclist may have caused another crash intentionally
Joanne Leigh Lawrence, 41, from Bullsbrook, has pleaded guilty to dangerous driving occasioning death, after she struck 70-year-old retired Professor Paola Ferroni on Kings Park Road in November 2014.

The court heard there was evidence Lawrence had sent and received text messages moments before the incident, in which Ms Ferroni was killed.

Defence lawyer Gary Massey told the court Lawrence crashed into a tree two weeks ago, on November 11, a day before she was due to attend a psychiatric assessment, as well as a victim mediation session.

State prosecutor Bradley Hollingsworth argued it was hard to believe Lawrence had not caused the crash deliberately. He said there was no evidence of braking or that the car had slid on gravel, as Mr Massey had suggested.

Judge Keen said he could not go ahead with the sentencing without a psychiatric report and adjourned it until January 29.

He disqualified Lawrence from driving, with the exception of taking her children to day care and school, and going to her medical appointments.
So you kill someone while texting then seemingly deliberately crash your car to avoid a psychiatric assessment and the judge still allows you to continue driving. Why do I get the feeling her final punishment won't be anything more than a slap on the wrist.

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Re: Cyclist Hit Kings Park this morning

Postby wellington_street » Thu Nov 26, 2015 4:26 pm

Just bizarre.

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biker jk
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Re: Cyclist Hit Kings Park this morning

Postby biker jk » Thu Nov 26, 2015 4:55 pm

wellington_street wrote:Just bizarre.
Yes, the driver's actions are bizarre but the weak response of the criminal "justice" system is not unusual at all (which is really sad).

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outnabike
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Re: Cyclist Hit Kings Park this morning

Postby outnabike » Thu Nov 26, 2015 8:09 pm

She attended court today for sentencing but due to other infringements (accidents) could not physically attend two hearings. Hard to believe the courts don't know that fact.
Similarly to the bike hit from the rear she hit a tree with no brake marks on the road.

https://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/wa/a/ ... tal-crash/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

A mother-of-two who fatally injured Paola Ferroni when she crashed her 4WD into the renowned professor's bike in West Perth was using her phone in the lead-up to the crash, a court has been told.
Professor Ferroni was riding along Kings Park Road in November last year when she was hit from behind by a Toyota Rav 4 being driven by Joanne Leigh Lawrence, 41.
Lawrence pleaded guilty to dangerous driving causing death and was due to be sentenced in the District Court today.
But the sentencing was adjourned because Lawrence was involved in another crash on November 11 and could not attend two court appointments as a result.
The court was told Lawrence ended up in hospital after she drove into a tree.
Prosecutor Bradley Hollingsworth said Lawrence sent and received a number of text messages in the six minutes leading up to the crash that killed Professor Ferroni.
He said there was no evidence of braking in the most recent crash and Lawrence had clearly driven dangerously again on this occasion.
"It is hard to believe that Mrs Lawrence has not done this deliberately," he said.
Outside court this morning, Professor Coates said she was disappointed with the delay but did not want to comment further until after Lawrence was sentenced.
Lawrence is due to appear in court again in January.
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ColinOldnCranky
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Re: Cyclist Hit Kings Park this morning

Postby ColinOldnCranky » Thu Nov 26, 2015 8:48 pm

OutnAbout states that her recent crash into a tree was not accompanied with any signs of braking. Has she got an issue with trees? Did she deliberately crash into a random tree to make a point to all other trees? Sound reasonable and likely to anyone?

Some may not want to hear this but the prosecutor only made an allegation on intent. He did not even attempt to PROVE it. I despair that reasonable people then argue as though it is the fact. "Seemingly" or otherwise.

I was not in attendance but AFAIK there was no hint of prior interaction between the driver and the victim. No one finger salute, no abuse, no tooting someone to get out of the way. Given that, any deliberate act would have been on a par with the actions of Edgar Eric Cooke, a thrill seeking sociopath of the highest magnitude. And Edgar Eric Cookes are still, thankfully, very rare. (Google him if you are under 60 and do not know the nature of his killings.)

Deliberately running him down? The evidence for that is about the same as presented by the defence for gravel being on the road. Totally plausible is inattention, texting and so forth and there is ample evidence to support that.

Let's just accept that the court found her guilty, which seemed the most plausible at the start and more so as the process ran. We do not need to compound the crime or find fault with judges and others that require little more than an allegation sans evidence of any sort by the prosecutor.

(End of rant. Awaits flames.)

I too am a little surprised about the interim driving privileges, especially in view of her recent unexplained crash. Not convinced that her kids are anhy better off because of it either. I guess the defense got some small victory. :?
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Sinner
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Re: Cyclist Hit Kings Park this morning

Postby Sinner » Fri Nov 27, 2015 10:41 am

But she can still drive until sentencing. Heaven help us all.......

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Re: Cyclist Hit Kings Park this morning

Postby biker jk » Fri Nov 27, 2015 11:14 am

Sinner wrote:But she can still drive until sentencing. Heaven help us all.......
Runs over and kills a cyclist, crashes into a tree, mental health issues. Seems legit to allow her to keep driving. Our "justice" system at work.

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