Biphasic sleep

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CKinnard
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Re: Biphasic sleep

Postby CKinnard » Mon Oct 05, 2015 6:49 pm

zill wrote:Thing is if I get to 80kg or above, don't have the need for junk but whenever, I get below 75kg, it can easily kick in or at least on my mind a few times a day. In this way, don't think it's depression. The only way I get around it is to not carry cash or cards around and this is working at the moment as I'm below 75kg.

Would taking Melatonine make me sleep better even if hungry at night? Or is that too risky to take as I'd be dependent on it?
Z, you are always looking for a quick fix. and always avoiding doing what the science recommends.
You say you like doing things scientifically, but you do anything but.

THis 75kg threshold you talk about is not set in stone. And there's no doubt you have not tested it under ideal conditions. i.e. eating a diet that is in accord with the Australian Dietary Guidelines. Are you seriously getting your 5 and 2 Zill?

The science says know your Calorie deficit, and to avoid cravings, don't stay up late. To facilitate normalizing endocrine biorhythms, go to bed early, wake up early and get some physical activity. It's really really simple....all it takes is trust in the science, and the will to tame the childish id within.

Do you have that will, Zill?

BTW, how tall are you and what's your waist circumference?

zill
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Re: Biphasic sleep

Postby zill » Mon Oct 05, 2015 7:53 pm

CKinnard wrote:
zill wrote:Thing is if I get to 80kg or above, don't have the need for junk but whenever, I get below 75kg, it can easily kick in or at least on my mind a few times a day. In this way, don't think it's depression. The only way I get around it is to not carry cash or cards around and this is working at the moment as I'm below 75kg.

Would taking Melatonine make me sleep better even if hungry at night? Or is that too risky to take as I'd be dependent on it?
Z, you are always looking for a quick fix. and always avoiding doing what the science recommends.
You say you like doing things scientifically, but you do anything but.

THis 75kg threshold you talk about is not set in stone. And there's no doubt you have not tested it under ideal conditions. i.e. eating a diet that is in accord with the Australian Dietary Guidelines. Are you seriously getting your 5 and 2 Zill?

The science says know your Calorie deficit, and to avoid cravings, don't stay up late. To facilitate normalizing endocrine biorhythms, go to bed early, wake up early and get some physical activity. It's really really simple....all it takes is trust in the science, and the will to tame the childish id within.

Do you have that will, Zill?

BTW, how tall are you and what's your waist circumference?
What is 5 and 2?

Looks like I'll just add a bit more healthy carbs for dinner, everything else remains the same, see how we go.

5'10, plenty of fat on me at the moment.

CKinnard
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Re: Biphasic sleep

Postby CKinnard » Mon Oct 05, 2015 8:36 pm

zill wrote:What is 5 and 2?

Looks like I'll just add a bit more healthy carbs for dinner, everything else remains the same, see how we go.

5'10, plenty of fat on me at the moment.


Didn't the dietitian cover all this with you? I suppose you've forgotten.

Work out your energy requirements (this is very rough, and doesn't allow for weight loss)
http://www.eatforhealth.gov.au/node/add ... r-servings" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

What's a serve size?
http://www.eatforhealth.gov.au/food-ess ... erve-sizes" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

98% of Australians don't get enough vegetables and fruit i.e. 5 and 2. I would put money on it you don't, and yet this is the most critical step you can take to managing bodyfat better.

You are not very scientific regardnig your waist circumference. Why do you use imperial measurements for your height?

zill
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Re: Biphasic sleep

Postby zill » Mon Oct 05, 2015 9:30 pm

Nice info. I'll redesign my diet around it. I'll also get a DEXA bodyscan next week and post it so everything is precise.

CKinnard
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Re: Biphasic sleep

Postby CKinnard » Mon Oct 05, 2015 9:35 pm

zill wrote:Nice info. I'll redesign my diet around it. I'll also get a DEXA bodyscan next week and post it so everything is precise.
On your bike Z!

zill
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Re: Biphasic sleep

Postby zill » Mon Oct 05, 2015 11:40 pm

CKinnard wrote:
zill wrote:Nice info. I'll redesign my diet around it. I'll also get a DEXA bodyscan next week and post it so everything is precise.
On your bike Z!


?????????? You want me to ride more?

CKinnard
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Re: Biphasic sleep

Postby CKinnard » Tue Oct 06, 2015 7:53 am

No Zill. I would not dare suggest you do anything you don't want to do.
In my life experience Zill, if you really really want something, you have to muster all of your will and energy and time, and prioritize going after it. You also have to let go of other stuff that gets in the way, whether you realize it or not.
The more you do this, the less questions you will need to ask others about why you are failing.

Nobody
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Re: Biphasic sleep

Postby Nobody » Tue Oct 06, 2015 8:23 am

CKinnard wrote:Having trouble gaining weight can be due to normal physiological processes. (brown adipose tissue and sympathetic nerve activity can ramp up metabolism for no other purpose than to burn off excess energy intake, which is why some people get very hot after eating a big meal. Not everyone has the same capacity for this though and it diminishes with age for most)

Having trouble losing weight is always due to abnormal or dysregulated physiology +/- learned behavior.

Weight set points are not set in stone. Some people have just deviated away from a healthy lifestyle and mindset more than others, and need to apply themselves more determinedly to change. For them, weight set points might seem more concrete. However, you need to turn that idea on its head. Some people just have very concrete setpoints for unhealthy lifestyle.

The majority of people gain weight as they get older, which doesn't support the concept of a hardwired set point.
I agree with this. The only set point people have is the set point for the type of diet they're on. I used to think I had an adult set point of about 80 kg because exercise and what I thought was healthier eating wasn't changing it. A naturopath once told me my ideal was 73 kg, BMI 24.4 and at the time I couldn't see how I was ever going to get there. Currently 64 and expecting to get back in the 63 range before summer.

fat and old
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Re: Biphasic sleep

Postby fat and old » Tue Oct 06, 2015 12:16 pm

CKinnard wrote: In my life experience Zill, if you really really want something, you have to muster all of your will and energy and time, and prioritize going after it. You also have to let go of other stuff that gets in the way, whether you realize it or not.
This is called "suffering" :wink:

edit...until it works. Then it's fun :)

zill
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Re: Biphasic sleep

Postby zill » Tue Oct 06, 2015 2:02 pm

Nobody wrote:
CKinnard wrote:Having trouble gaining weight can be due to normal physiological processes. (brown adipose tissue and sympathetic nerve activity can ramp up metabolism for no other purpose than to burn off excess energy intake, which is why some people get very hot after eating a big meal. Not everyone has the same capacity for this though and it diminishes with age for most)

Having trouble losing weight is always due to abnormal or dysregulated physiology +/- learned behavior.

Weight set points are not set in stone. Some people have just deviated away from a healthy lifestyle and mindset more than others, and need to apply themselves more determinedly to change. For them, weight set points might seem more concrete. However, you need to turn that idea on its head. Some people just have very concrete setpoints for unhealthy lifestyle.

The majority of people gain weight as they get older, which doesn't support the concept of a hardwired set point.
I agree with this. The only set point people have is the set point for the type of diet they're on. I used to think I had an adult set point of about 80 kg because exercise and what I thought was healthier eating wasn't changing it. A naturopath once told me my ideal was 73 kg, BMI 24.4 and at the time I couldn't see how I was ever going to get there. Currently 64 and expecting to get back in the 63 range before summer.
Very interesting. Will keep it in mind.

zill
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Joined: Tue Dec 17, 2013 11:34 pm

Re: Biphasic sleep

Postby zill » Tue Oct 06, 2015 2:06 pm

CKinnard wrote:No Zill. I would not dare suggest you do anything you don't want to do.
In my life experience Zill, if you really really want something, you have to muster all of your will and energy and time, and prioritize going after it. You also have to let go of other stuff that gets in the way, whether you realize it or not.
The more you do this, the less questions you will need to ask others about why you are failing.

I have always loved sport and healthy living but deep down don't think I'm "built" for it (as in being or near elite level).

I'll just take it slowly.

zill
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Re: Biphasic sleep

Postby zill » Wed Oct 21, 2015 5:44 pm

CKinnard wrote: In my life experience Zill, if you really really want something, you have to muster all of your will and energy and time, and prioritize going after it. You also have to let go of other stuff that gets in the way, whether you realize it or not.
The more you do this, the less questions you will need to ask others about why you are failing.


Got the DEXA scan today. As expected, body fat is pretty high at just over 15%. Gained 3kg of muscle from doing weights in the upper body but probably not a good thing to have given that I like to concentrate on hill riding hence watts/kg.

The doctor basically said the same thing that it's really about how strong the motivation is with regards to weight loss.

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biker jk
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Re: Biphasic sleep

Postby biker jk » Wed Oct 21, 2015 5:54 pm

zill wrote:
CKinnard wrote: In my life experience Zill, if you really really want something, you have to muster all of your will and energy and time, and prioritize going after it. You also have to let go of other stuff that gets in the way, whether you realize it or not.
The more you do this, the less questions you will need to ask others about why you are failing.


Got the DEXA scan today. As expected, body fat is pretty high at just over 15%. Gained 3kg of muscle from doing weights in the upper body but probably not a good thing to have given that I like to concentrate on hill riding hence watts/kg.

The doctor basically said the same thing that it's really about how strong the motivation is with regards to weight loss.
So you went from 8%-9% body fat in March to 15% in October?

zill
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Joined: Tue Dec 17, 2013 11:34 pm

Re: Biphasic sleep

Postby zill » Wed Oct 21, 2015 6:29 pm

biker jk wrote:
zill wrote:
CKinnard wrote: In my life experience Zill, if you really really want something, you have to muster all of your will and energy and time, and prioritize going after it. You also have to let go of other stuff that gets in the way, whether you realize it or not.
The more you do this, the less questions you will need to ask others about why you are failing.


Got the DEXA scan today. As expected, body fat is pretty high at just over 15%. Gained 3kg of muscle from doing weights in the upper body but probably not a good thing to have given that I like to concentrate on hill riding hence watts/kg.

The doctor basically said the same thing that it's really about how strong the motivation is with regards to weight loss.
So you went from 8%-9% body fat in March to 15% in October?

You have a good memory! Thing is I was probably lower than that in body fat in March since I started doing weights in Jan but used pre weights lean body mass to calculate my % body fat. Really regretting not getting a scan during that time.


Everything turned around after I got injured in late April. It also coincided with the onset of cooler weather. Gained lots of weight during that time and have been losing it very slowly. I need some new motivations to be competitive again.

zill
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Re: Biphasic sleep

Postby zill » Wed Oct 21, 2015 11:16 pm

Looking back, exactly two years ago, I was 102kg but was very determined to lose as much kg as possible in the hope of getting into competitive cycling. Ended up losing 30kg averaging losing 3kg/month so lost 30 kg in a little over 9 months healthily with excellent will power. However, after that got into binge eating habits (maybe I was too satisfied with my efforts and got arrogant) and then yo yo ed around but still achieved 67.3kg (first thing in the morning weigh) by cycling lots but binge ate around. Since I was also doing weights back then, I would have been possibly 6% body fat. Now however, I am feeling desperate at persistently unable to lose minor kgs compared to 2 years ago. I am now trying to adopt similar methodologies of 2 years ago - that is humbleness and will power. More importantly, adopting healthy habits and treating everything as lifestyle rather than a view of dieting.

zill
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Re: Biphasic sleep

Postby zill » Thu Oct 22, 2015 12:30 am

Thinking back, a key psychological strategy is not to view eating as a form of enjoyment/pleasure. View it as a necessity instead like taking a shower for example.

I'm trying to learn from the former me!

fat and old
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Re: Biphasic sleep

Postby fat and old » Thu Oct 22, 2015 6:41 am

zill wrote:Looking back, exactly two years ago, I was 102kg but was very determined to lose as much kg as possible in the hope of getting into competitive cycling. Ended up losing 30kg averaging losing 3kg/month so lost 30 kg in a little over 9 months healthily with excellent will power.
Where's the kudos button?

zill
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Joined: Tue Dec 17, 2013 11:34 pm

Re: Biphasic sleep

Postby zill » Thu Oct 22, 2015 11:21 am

fat and old wrote:
zill wrote:Looking back, exactly two years ago, I was 102kg but was very determined to lose as much kg as possible in the hope of getting into competitive cycling. Ended up losing 30kg averaging losing 3kg/month so lost 30 kg in a little over 9 months healthily with excellent will power.
Where's the kudos button?

Lesson learned is that its all about eating habits and psychology. After this period of 9 months of successful weight loss, took another 9 months to lose the last 5kg due to some very bad binge eating habits. I am 77kg now and since yesterday was still in this bad period. However, as of today am going back to that first 9 months period and see how I will be able to lose the kgs!

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