What to do about cramps

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silentC
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What to do about cramps

Postby silentC » Tue Nov 17, 2015 3:38 pm

I rode the Bass Coast Cycle 121km on Saturday. Finished inside 4 1/2 hours so I was reasonably happy but I was plagued with cramps in the quads and calves from about 30km in. I wasn't able to climb and time trialling on the flats was out of the question. I went out with the first group and the initial pace was pretty quick until we hit the hills but I backed off a bit before then because I didn't want to bonk. It was after the first descent and into the second climb that I started feeling it. Basically made it around the course in limp mode.

I haven't ridden hard over that distance before, so I think I probably went outside the envelope a bit. I was talking to some people about it and they seem to think that hydration in the couple of days before the event is the key, others say magnesium tablets. But I found an article that covers the research, and it basically says that nutrition and hydration play very little part in it and that it's all just down to pushing yourself harder or for longer than you normally would.

Is it just that better training is required, or maybe I just went a bit silly because of the number of cyclists all in one place. I thought maybe there's something happening there with chemicals like adrenalin being produced, letting you think you can go harder than you really can.

Just interested in hearing if anyone has been able to find something that works, because I don't want to go through another event like that.
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Jesmol
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Re: What to do about cramps

Postby Jesmol » Tue Nov 17, 2015 3:42 pm

Try tonic water, Potassium, Magnesium, hydration have all done nothing for me. Tonic water is the only thing thats worked.

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silentC
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Re: What to do about cramps

Postby silentC » Tue Nov 17, 2015 3:44 pm

With or without gin? :)

Do you take that on the bike or drink before hand?
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Re: What to do about cramps

Postby Jesmol » Tue Nov 17, 2015 3:46 pm

silentC wrote:With or without gin? :)

Do you take that on the bike or drink before hand?
I drink one glass a day, whether or not I'm riding.

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bychosis
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Re: What to do about cramps

Postby bychosis » Tue Nov 17, 2015 4:03 pm

I get cramps too in longer events. They are typically well outside my normal riding distance/time. I am not an athlete, just a punter who likes to push myself for endurance/marathon events. I have completed a dozen or so 100km MTB events with training consisting of around up to 35km off road or 2hrs riding when the event takes me well over 6hrs.

Have tried upping magnesium for a couple of weeks before the event with supplements and also ensure I pre-hydrate for a few days before and staying hydrated on the bike, which is harder than I realised. Seems to help a bit. For me I think the only solution is better preparation for my body. ie getting the kms into my legs more regularly, my best results, cramping wise have been after the most 'training'
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silentC
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Re: What to do about cramps

Postby silentC » Tue Nov 17, 2015 4:21 pm

Yes it makes sense to me that the fitter you are the higher the threshold. Proper athletes get cramps too but probably only when they push too hard.

What surprised me was how soon I got them. My training rides are usually around 60 to 80km and reasonably fast but this hit me only an hour or so in. The early part of the ride was about 36kph for half an hour or so but flat and I felt pretty good at the time, not working very hard at all. The first climb (Mt Misery) isn't that bad, 3km 6%, our training hill is 5.5km at 6% and takes over an hour to get to. I just can't work out what I did wrong...
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Calvin27
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Re: What to do about cramps

Postby Calvin27 » Tue Nov 17, 2015 5:02 pm

I can get cramps on a 20km ride, or a 200km one. Intensity is key for me. Threshold power means squat to me wrt cramps. Some days I can smash a ride and have nothing, others I will cramp very early. Possibly there are a lot of factors btu I've tried magnesium and it does not a lot. I suspect it has more to do with muscle condition - over rested or still recovering. Either way I basically have to 'know' my legs and feel how they are going. It's very easy to follow a bunch and then try smash a climb and then hey, cramps are along for the ride.

I also think that cramps are sort of like, once you get them, they keep coming back. For example if I ride extra hard and then cramp, even a week later I will probably cramp on a ride where previously I wouldn't have - I become more suseptible to it. Because of this, I tend to give my legs lots of rest and easy riding when I get cramps otherwise they just sieze up.

Just broscience here, but I swear by it haha.
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silentC
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Re: What to do about cramps

Postby silentC » Tue Nov 17, 2015 5:54 pm

Yeah I did a moderate paced 40km/720m this morning. Pushed it a bit up the hills but I could feel the right quad starting to go a bit so backed off. I don't think they do any lasting damage but things probably get a bit inflamed.

On Saturday it came and went. I'd be going along OK for awhile and then it would start again, I could feel my quads coiling up like rope and I'd have to back off again. It came good for about the last 20km and I was working well with a couple of others but I had to let them go about 1k from the finish. There's an undulating bit that runs from Wonthaggi into Inverloch and I tried to punch it up the (tiny) hills but that was the end of me.
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Re: What to do about cramps

Postby g-boaf » Thu Nov 19, 2015 8:37 am

How is your bike fit, cleat position, etc?

Pay attention to hydration, and try to do the usual excercises like calf raises to help strength the calf muscles. Also, use a foam roller to roll out those muscles. After any decent ride, you want to do stretching.

When you've tried all that, the rest is just getting used to the distance. But it seems like you are probably a fast rider from what you've described above, so I doubt we can offer much further advice.

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Re: What to do about cramps

Postby Gunlock » Thu Nov 19, 2015 9:00 am

g-boaf wrote:Pay attention to hydration.
Should have read this yesterday. Had to pull out of a race last night with 3 laps to go with some major cramping in my right calf due to dehydration.
Last edited by Gunlock on Thu Nov 19, 2015 9:52 am, edited 1 time in total.

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silentC
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Re: What to do about cramps

Postby silentC » Thu Nov 19, 2015 9:38 am

g-boaf wrote:How is your bike fit, cleat position, etc?

Pay attention to hydration, and try to do the usual excercises like calf raises to help strength the calf muscles. Also, use a foam roller to roll out those muscles. After any decent ride, you want to do stretching.

When you've tried all that, the rest is just getting used to the distance. But it seems like you are probably a fast rider from what you've described above, so I doubt we can offer much further advice.
Bike fit is OK I think, apart from the cramps I felt pretty good. No knee pain or anything like that. I've got the cleats back as far as they will go because I was having some mid-foot issues. Only thing is I tend to point my toes, have to try and concentrate on dropping the heel.

Yeah I think it is probably just getting used to the distance/intensity and riding a bit smarter. I went out way too hard early trying to chase some stronger riders and should have sat back with the second bunch. Then I was stranded in the middle for the rest of the ride and had to do 90% of the effort on my own. Although the guy who 'won' (it's not a race!) did the last 100km on his own. But then he is 21...
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Derny Driver
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Re: What to do about cramps

Postby Derny Driver » Thu Nov 19, 2015 9:55 am

There are a lot of myths associated with cramps. The main reason for cramping is muscle fatigue.

Good article here from Stadium Clinic North Sydney
http://www.stadiumclinic.com.au/pdf/exe ... cramps.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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Re: What to do about cramps

Postby silentC » Thu Nov 19, 2015 11:21 am

Excellent, thanks. Pretty much agrees with the article I read.
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Re: What to do about cramps

Postby kb » Thu Nov 19, 2015 12:41 pm

silentC wrote:Excellent, thanks. Pretty much agrees with the article I read.
+1
Tallies with personal observations/experience too.
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Re: What to do about cramps

Postby Addictr3 » Sun Nov 22, 2015 5:58 pm

supplement 3g taurine.
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Re: What to do about cramps

Postby ComradeSpear » Sat Dec 05, 2015 4:43 pm

I can only talk about my experience but I found conditioning prior to a ride and hydration during a ride are key.

In conditioning, I mean the body needs to be used to the distance your riding AT the intensity you're going to ride at. Also, prior to a ride then drink plenty and during the ride you need to eat and drink enough to compensate the body. I don't cramp as much as before but that's just my trial and error to mitigate cramps.

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Re: What to do about cramps

Postby rodneycc » Sat Dec 05, 2015 9:52 pm

I stick hydralite in my bottle/s if I know I'm in for a long one. Usually does the trick for me. Also sometimes I take a centrum multi vitamin if I'm paranoid.

I also do the same if I'm in for a big one on the turps! :-)
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silentC
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Re: What to do about cramps

Postby silentC » Tue Dec 08, 2015 10:16 am

Yes better preparation next time I think...
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Re: What to do about cramps

Postby kenwstr » Fri Dec 18, 2015 6:41 pm

From what I have read, there are quite a number of possible factors. However, the literature suggests number one by far is lack of adequate hydration. I have been plagued by cramps for some time and eventually come to conclude this is my most likely suspect. I resisted the notion for some time and being older, don't have much thirst response. Basically I make a concious effort to hydrate well before riding. Hydrate properly during the ride, also I weigh myself before and after the ride, the difference is the post ride hydration deficite I need to make up ASAP. Electrolite ballance is an issue, sodium/patasium and calcium/magnesium are less of an issue but still quite important. Overtraining, increases greater than 10% are a strict no no, including intensity. Increase training gradually. Unusually high intensity often cause cramps during rides. Go to a lower gear, less load and lower intensity to get home. Hydration, electrolites, warm bath, compression garments, more hydration, panadol or similar to relax muscles, seems to be a good plan when warning signs occur. Tightness or cramp during ride, twitching muscles at any time after a ride, hard or heavey belly.

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Re: What to do about cramps

Postby greyhoundtom » Mon Dec 21, 2015 8:15 am

While it may not impact directly on human exercise induced cramping, forty years of being involved on a daily basis with greyhound athletes that can and do suffer from severe cramping, I have found the following vital to minimizing its occurrence.

(1) sufficient dietary intake of both potassium and calcium.
While taking supplements of both these essential minerals in the 48 hours prior to an event can be beneficial it does not make up for long term low body levels. Also it is not often clearly understood by athletes that calcium is essential for correct neuromuscular function and tends to be forgotten when it comes to dietary sufficiency.

(2) Appropriately graded exercise regime to prepare for events requiring maximum physical effort both for endurance and intensity.
Which I have no doubt is understood by most athletes, but not necessarily strictly adhered to because most have this strong self belief that when the chips are down they will come through, only to fall in a hole or do themselves damage.

(3) Thorough deep tissue massage to the main muscle groups affected by the chosen exercise 8 to 10 hours after maximum physical effort.
Again this is far too often not done at an appropriate time to relieve and relax deep seated small sections of contracted muscle fibers. While these are not painful and often only noted as a slightly tight muscle, the long term effects can increase the incidence of cramping.
The main reason being that the tightness of the muscle fibers actually reduces the blood flow to the affected area, and this in turn reduces recovery and healing of those muscle fibers.
Individual muscle cells affected in this manner can lose their ability to function and contract as required reducing the overall efficiency of that section of muscle fiber in the long term, and can result in an increased incidence of cramping in that particular muscle group.

....... And as always without appropriate hydration everything falls apart.

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Re: What to do about cramps

Postby silentC » Wed Dec 23, 2015 7:30 pm

All good stuff, thank you.
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Re: What to do about cramps

Postby skydance » Mon Jan 11, 2016 3:51 pm

Haven't had cramps during (or straight after) workout. But I've got another problem. If I stop exercising for a few days, one morning I'm waking up and can barely walk. Right or both quads are cramping and every step I do is quite painful. It may continue for 3-4 days, unless I start taking serious dose of magnesium (with magnesium it takes 1-2 days at most).

Article mentioned above does not help much, as it's not fatigue.

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What to do about cramps

Postby RonK » Mon Jan 11, 2016 4:15 pm

What you are describing sounds like DOMS to me.
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Re: What to do about cramps

Postby g-boaf » Thu Jan 14, 2016 7:25 am

skydance wrote:Haven't had cramps during (or straight after) workout. But I've got another problem. If I stop exercising for a few days, one morning I'm waking up and can barely walk. Right or both quads are cramping and every step I do is quite painful. It may continue for 3-4 days, unless I start taking serious dose of magnesium (with magnesium it takes 1-2 days at most).

Article mentioned above does not help much, as it's not fatigue.

Try an easy ride next day, two hours at low power and easy gear? Stretching should help too.

I know what DOMS is like (described above), but that's just heavy and sore legs, rather than sharp cramping pain.

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Re: What to do about cramps

Postby skydance » Thu Jan 14, 2016 11:34 am

It's not DOMS, I know how it feels.

As I said, this only happens when I'm unable to do any workout, not two hours, not even half an hour, due to various reasons (mostly family duties). Stretching and foam roller do not help much, doing a short run/ride does.

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