Help with Indoor trainer deliberations

[AndyRevill]

Hi all,

I ride for fitness and fun and don't race but I've been getting a bit fed up of my routine constantly being interrupted. I'll get a few weeks where I can ride 4-5 days and then I get busy with work or running kids around, not to mention the Tassie weather and end up not riding much for a few weeks so I feel like I go backwards and end up where I started. I've decided to invest in an indoor trainer so at least I can get an hour or so in when things conspire against me. After a lot of searching on here and around the web I've pretty much landed at the Kurt Kinetic road machine paired with TrainerRoad - my personal spin class

Seems this is about the sweet spot in terms of quality and price for someone like me. However, one thing nagging at me is do I need to factor in a spare wheel and trainer tyre (or getting through my road tyre a lot quicker)? I've seen a lot of conflicting views so I'm hoping there are enough users on here that I might be able to come to some decision. If I do need to include that in the costing then I'm starting to get close to the cost of the Lemond revolution, which a lot of people also seem to like (noise aside).

So, votes yay or nay on needing the extra wheel+tyre?

Thanks, Andy

[moosterbounce]

I went with the extra wheel when I first set up my trainer. I got an old wheel which was slightly out of true that wasn't in great nick with 10sp cassette. I did get a trainer tire too eventually but used old ones for a while. The extra wheel was minimum cost as it was probably unable to be used on the road, so I probably only paid for the cassette. I've had it for 8 years now and have done nothing to it. Change over was easy and i loved that u was using my own bike - familiarization with my pedals and seat etc was brilliant.
If you go this route though, be wary of the wheel and frame and tyre. Initially, I used a road bike which was fine. Then moved the wheel to a tt bike which was also fine but only with a conti trainer tyre. When I replaced that with a Tacx trainer tyre, it rubbed on the aero frame due to the wheel being slightly out of true. Showed the tacxbtyre was thicker than the conti.
I can't speak for the lemond tho.

[Xplora]

Factor in murdering a tyre if you're using it a lot. Spare wheel is pretty much free. Should be able to rustle it up without much stress.

I've got the Road Machine, it's very good but I'm actually looking to go to rollers right now - you don't get any practice on balancing or handling the bike on the trainer, and you don't chew tyres the same way. You can do trainerroad with the Sportcrafter variable resistance rollers and a few other options out there. If you want to zone out, you can use a front wheel bracket to make the handling a nonissue. Price is a bit cheaper.

Lots of people really dislike trainers because they are boring, but like rollers. You won't fall off a trainer though

[AndyRevill]

Factor in murdering a tyre if you're using it a lot. Spare wheel is pretty much free. Should be able to rustle it up without much stress.

I've got the Road Machine, it's very good but I'm actually looking to go to rollers right now - you don't get any practice on balancing or handling the bike on the trainer, and you don't chew tyres the same way. You can do trainerroad with the Sportcrafter variable resistance rollers and a few other options out there. If you want to zone out, you can use a front wheel bracket to make the handling a nonissue. Price is a bit cheaper.

Lots of people really dislike trainers because they are boring, but like rollers. You won't fall off a trainer though

Hadn't really thought about rollers until now - didn't realise you could get variable resistance ones and they work with TR - life just got more complicated!

Does having parabolic rollers make much of a difference to not falling off? I've had a quick look to see if I could gauge what type of workout I might get. The power curves suggest the KK can go through the roof if you're strong enough, which is not me. Looking at the power at 25mph (40kmh) the KK = 400W, the Sportcrafters = 300W and the Elite mag rollers = 300 - 550W depending on which setting you're on. Suggests the Elite might be worth a look?

Thanks, Andy

[Xplora]

Resistance has nothing to do with speed. Ignore that right now. Wattage is effort to the pedals over a period of time. I can crank 1200-1300W to the pedals but it's typically at 60rpm - the beginning of a sprint in top gear. Don't do that. I suck at sprinting

I've seen a graph showing the Sportcrafter resistance rollers at 800W. You will probably max out around 600W if you aren't sprinting - 600W is out of the saddle pushing strong, without ripping the handlebars off and losing traction on the front. "I" would not consider the difference in power to the Road Machine to be worth worrying about. Rollers requires a lot more control and care than a trainer, you'll get less drama trying to pedal hard with rollers (I am guessing) because you'll fall off. Trainer, you want epic resistance because you are spinning without moving and you can apply more force. This isn't always a good thing like I mentioned - no point being fast without controlling the bike.

Mag resistance is a bit different, it's a flat reduction in your speed, it works differently to the variable resistance of the Sportcrafter rollers or the fluid resistance of the KK or other fluid trainers. There is more to it than this, but the cork sniffer should be satisfied with the Sportcrafter solution.

[Xplora]

Decided to put my trainer on the market, if you're keen Andy. Trainer and a Bontrager wheel to match the Domane

[AndyRevill]

Decided to put my trainer on the market, if you're keen Andy. Trainer and a Bontrager wheel to match the Domane

Might be can you PM me with details?

[AndyRevill]

Decided to put my trainer on the market, if you're keen Andy. Trainer and a Bontrager wheel to match the Domane

Might be can you PM me with details?

Should have looked in the FS section first

[Xplora]

All good. Bing....You got mail.

[SuperSix]

If your looking for high resistance have a look at the Jetblack z1 or dynometer trainers. I have the z1 and it has pretty high resistance and even more when cold.
It also has a polymer roller which really does seem to aid tyre life. I've been on it about 3 or 4 times a week for six weeks and the tyre still looks new. You can still see the seam down the centre of it.
I did get another wheel for it but it probably wasn't necessary.

[anthcon]

Hi all,

I ride for fitness and fun and don't race but I've been getting a bit fed up of my routine constantly being interrupted. I'll get a few weeks where I can ride 4-5 days and then I get busy with work or running kids around, not to mention the Tassie weather and end up not riding much for a few weeks so I feel like I go backwards and end up where I started. I've decided to invest in an indoor trainer so at least I can get an hour or so in when things conspire against me. After a lot of searching on here and around the web I've pretty much landed at the Kurt Kinetic road machine paired with TrainerRoad - my personal spin class

Seems this is about the sweet spot in terms of quality and price for someone like me. However, one thing nagging at me is do I need to factor in a spare wheel and trainer tyre (or getting through my road tyre a lot quicker)? I've seen a lot of conflicting views so I'm hoping there are enough users on here that I might be able to come to some decision. If I do need to include that in the costing then I'm starting to get close to the cost of the Lemond revolution, which a lot of people also seem to like (noise aside).

So, votes yay or nay on needing the extra wheel+tyre?

Thanks, Andy

what sort of money is a trainer and training tyre/spare wheel goint to cost all up approx.???,,,,

[Phil]

I use the TACX BUSHIDO, up to 1400watts resistance. Have had it a couple of years, upgraded to the Ipad bracket and app recently, worth a look if budget will stretch that far.

I use the Stages powermeter on my Domane, and the Bushido power and cadence are pretty consistent with that.

Decent review on DCRAINMAKER.

[AndyRevill]

what sort of money is a trainer and training tyre/spare wheel goint to cost all up approx.???,,,,

The best I've seen for the KK road machine in Australia is $499. Spare wheel/tyre not sure, if you have an old tyre kicking around that helps. There are cheaper trainers but the KK has really good reports.

If you want to use up half your life there is a mass of info around the web

Andy

[anthcon]

What about one of these?

Value for money at around $6?? I would think. Might be better systems but also twice the price
http://www.dcrainmaker.com/2012/12/bkoo ... eview.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Xplora]

18 months old, anth. Tech based equipment moves on more than that. I would REALLY recommend you avoid trainer based power such as the Wahoo Kickr or the others, until you've got a power meter on the bike. The extra money that a Kickr costs over the Road Machine for example is around 800-900 bucks. They retail 1400 right now, and are flying out the door according to a couple sources. You get the same results from a power meter and a Road Machine, but you can take the power meter onto the road. I agree a Kickr or a bkool or whatever is a great idea, I would love to have one, but we have to recognise that power on the road is more important, unless you are staying inside and never riding on the road or track.

I'm very pleased with my Road Machine/power meter combo. If you can't afford a power meter, just get the trainer and put the extra 200 in the bank to save up for the power meter. Kickr and such toys are for rich people who can afford a Quarq AND the trainer.

[jpw5]

I just purchased a new KK Road Machine 2.0 with KK wheel riser for $498 from a bike shop in Melbourne. Think it was around $460 or so without riser. Looks like a solid machine and look forward to giving it a crack.

[djw47]

I spend a lot of time on the trainer in winter due to work hours and weather and have an old mountain bike set up with slick tyres as my training bike. Don't forget in addition to the tyres, the additional wear and tear on the wheels and chainset as well as sweating over your frame.

If your looking for high resistance have a look at the Jetblack z1 or dynometer trainers. I have the z1 and it has pretty high resistance and even more when cold.
It also has a polymer roller which really does seem to aid tyre life. I've been on it about 3 or 4 times a week for six weeks and the tyre still looks new. You can still see the seam down the centre of it.
I did get another wheel for it but it probably wasn't necessary.

+1 for the Jetblack z1, I've had one for 3 years, used extensively in the winter, up to 100km a week sometimes and never worn out a tyre. Make sure you use the slickest tyres you can though to reduce the noise.

[jacks1071]

Factor in murdering a tyre if you're using it a lot. Spare wheel is pretty much free. Should be able to rustle it up without much stress.

I've got the Road Machine, it's very good but I'm actually looking to go to rollers right now - you don't get any practice on balancing or handling the bike on the trainer, and you don't chew tyres the same way. You can do trainerroad with the Sportcrafter variable resistance rollers and a few other options out there. If you want to zone out, you can use a front wheel bracket to make the handling a nonissue. Price is a bit cheaper.

Lots of people really dislike trainers because they are boring, but like rollers. You won't fall off a trainer though

How much tension do you put on the roller? I'm pretty sure Kurt specify to do 3x full turns once the resistance unit touches the tyre.

I'd imagine that too much or too little tension or low pressure in the tyre could all cause premature wear. A few years ago I put over 100 hours on my KK within 6-months on the same tyre I was road riding and it didn't wear out any quicker than using it on the road.

Some trainers have a rough finish on the roller and those ones burn tyres up - typically they are the cheap and nasty trainers though.

For 99% of the population a spare wheel would be a waste, just use your everyday wheel and tyre - but if you have a busted spare wheel that isn't good enough to road ride anymore then why not? In which case - use up your old tyres with cuts in them etc to finish them off.

[Xplora]

I put 2 turns exactly, which held tension fine unless I put down 600-800W after spinning 100w for recovery. For those using Trainerroad or the voodoo FTP methods that you can do with the KK using the supplied power curve, consistent tightness is very useful.

If someone is using dedicated race wheels and race tyres, I don't think it's a worthwhile risk to knowingly chew them because they are SO EXPENSIVE and SO SOFT. Whatever makes them great for racing means they can't handle the trainer abuse. That's OK. God has given us spare rear tyres and commuter wheels to resolve this problem, and if you can afford a second set of wheels for racing then you can afford to have a trainer wheel... a crappy wheel and crap tyre might be 60-80 bucks, while the nice tyre would be 50-60 bucks. Easy maths for me. I can afford power meters but can't afford to waste cash on consumables ruining my nice tyres. I know I had to clean off a little bit of tyre muck before boxing up my KK to send it to AndyR... considering how much use the trainer got, that's a lot of rubber to my mind. It's a babysmooth roller on the KK, but physics is like that. Ultrasports are junky tyres though!