Talk me down from the edge of the cliff

[DaveQB]

Hi all,

The LBS is a Specialized shop and Specialized has sales on atm. I am not been tempted with a new bike until now. This got me looking around and reading reviews etc. I am looking at the Merida Reacto and Specialized Venge. A Madone 9 would be a dream but even the 9.2 is over $5k and doesn't allow for clip-on aerobars (I do like putting the aerobars on and ripping around a 40 or 60km loop near my place, as fast as I can).

I have only been riding for 2-3 years and have only ever ridden my Trek Madone 6 which was made in 2006 (got it second hand). I've been told I'd be better suited on a 56 size bike (my Trek is size 58) and my Trek can't take bigger than 23mm tyres (I do some 200km Audax riding as well so some 28mm tyres for a little more comfort on those days would be good).

Got to ride another bike for the first time yesterday A test fide of a Reacto 7000-E. It was nice but not "unbelievable" to ride when compared to my Trek. It did have a nice kick when going up some short, sharp hills near the shop (more stiff I assume). Di2 was interesting but I want to hold out to when etap has a WiFli RD for an 11-32t cassette (I need it).

Anyway, I don't need a bike, so trying to persuade myself I shouldn't buy anything but I thought I'd let others get in my head and enjoy all my thinking with me

[jasonc]

meh. you only live once. if it makes you want to ride more, buy it

[}SkOrPn--7]

Just jump and save us all from later issues. Oh oops I just read you post it's a buying conundrum

Ricky

[TheWall]

Not sure this place is the best placed to be 'talked down'..my recent SWorks Tarmac purchase might be proof of that (ha ha) - Specialized are not always on sale...

Probably a gearing issue more than anything else but there were a few Venge's in use on a 220klm ride last week...the riders were not happy campers on hills and towards the end after so many hrs in the saddle.

[RonK]

Nope - you got yourself up there, you get yourself down.

[jerrah]

Probably a gearing issue more than anything else but there were a few Venge's in use on a 220klm ride last week...the riders were not happy campers on hills and towards the end after so many hrs in the saddle.

I understood that the Venge and the Tarmac has near identical geometry. Is it likely to be a comfort issue wit the venge or the riders themselves? You'd think with all the claimed aero gains they should be doing it easier if anything?

[dontazame]

Hi all,

I do like putting the aerobars on and ripping around a 40 or 60km loop near my place, as fast as I can.
It was nice but not "unbelievable" to ride when compared to my Trek.
I want to hold out to when etap has a WiFli RD for an 11-32t cassette (I need it).
I don't need a bike

If it aint broke....

[TheWall]

Nope - you got yourself up there, you get yourself down.

one of the better replies seen on this forum. Nice work.

[Mulger bill]

Hi all,

I do like putting the aerobars on and ripping around a 40 or 60km loop near my place, as fast as I can.
It was nice but not "unbelievable" to ride when compared to my Trek.
I want to hold out to when etap has a WiFli RD for an 11-32t cassette (I need it).
I don't need a bike

If it aint broke....

Yep, why go with "She's a great bike, but..."?
Wait for the one to present

[MattyK]

Why not N+1 a time trial bike?

[Cheesewheel]

Wait a month for the eofy sale and buy two

[DaveQB]

meh. you only live once. if it makes you want to ride more, buy it

I have been thinking along those lines, but I don't think I could fit much more riding in, so maybe I should wait to when my motivation slacks off before a purchase...

Just jump and save us all from later issues. Oh oops I just read you post it's a buying conundrum

Ricky

Hahaha.

Not sure this place is the best placed to be 'talked down'..my recent SWorks Tarmac purchase might be proof of that (ha ha) - Specialized are not always on sale...

Fair point. Maybe sub-consciously I am trying to be talking INTO the purchase

Probably a gearing issue more than anything else but there were a few Venge's in use on a 220klm ride last week...the riders were not happy campers on hills and towards the end after so many hrs in the saddle.

I know the Venge typically comes in a 36 front chainring and a 25 rear, so not the best for climbing, at least not for me. Was their's a comfort issue? My only concern with comfort is performance. I don't mind the bumps, but I have been unable to complete a 300km Audax ride and I was wondering if a more comfortable bike would help my performance in a long ride like that.

Nope - you got yourself up there, you get yourself down.

Hahaha. How the heck did I get here.....

If it aint broke....

You might be right...

Yep, why go with "She's a great bike, but..."?
Wait for the one to present

Yes, I think I need more test riding of different bikes, but I can't find a way to test ride a Venge

Why not N+1 a time trial bike?

I have thought that. I thought maybe a gravel/comfort bike and a TT bike to cover both ends, but then I thought I could go the Aero bike and use clip-on aerobars to have "2 bikes" out of one....

Wait a month for the eofy sale and buy two

Are they coming? Normally worth the wait? Both Merida (from 99bikes) and Specialized have sales on now.
A mate said he thinks the Venge Vias design will be flowing down to the lower models, so that might explain their sales.

Thanks all.

[MattyK]

Why not N+1 a time trial bike?

I have thought that. I thought maybe a gravel/comfort bike and a TT bike to cover both ends, but then I thought I could go the Aero bike and use clip-on aerobars to have "2 bikes" out of one....

Trouble is you'll be wanting to change bar/stem position, saddle position, maybe saddle type, etc. Aero bar setup isn't as simple as just bolting on the extensions. Annoying if you want to go for a bunch/hill ride one day and a TT the next. I'm in the same boat but I don't have the luxury of looking at a second bike...

[DaveQB]

Why not N+1 a time trial bike?

I have thought that. I thought maybe a gravel/comfort bike and a TT bike to cover both ends, but then I thought I could go the Aero bike and use clip-on aerobars to have "2 bikes" out of one....

Trouble is you'll be wanting to change bar/stem position, saddle position, maybe saddle type, etc. Aero bar setup isn't as simple as just bolting on the extensions. Annoying if you want to go for a bunch/hill ride one day and a TT the next. I'm in the same boat but I don't have the luxury of looking at a second bike...

Yes I was worried about that. But I have made some markers for my saddle (TT position and road position). Slide that forward and back and clip on the aerobars. Seems to be working so far. I am sure not perfect though but I am novice enough that it's good enough.
A flippable seat post like on the Reacto and Venge is attractive

[Duck!]

Probably a gearing issue more than anything else but there were a few Venge's in use on a 220klm ride last week...the riders were not happy campers on hills and towards the end after so many hrs in the saddle.

I understood that the Venge and the Tarmac has near identical geometry. Is it likely to be a comfort issue wit the venge or the riders themselves? You'd think with all the claimed aero gains they should be doing it easier if anything?

Probably a bit of both. The Venge is very hard-nosed aggro race bike aimed at getting as much of the rider's grunt through to the ground as possible, and as such is a pretty uncompromising beast (but you can be damn sure it's nicer to ride than a similarly-profiled aluminium bike!). The Tarmac, while still racing geometry, is more of an all-rounder, and more forgiving as a result. Aero doesn't mean much going up hills. If anything aero often comes with a weight penalty, as usually more material is needed to form the tube shapes. That said, that sector of the bike market does tend to appeal to the stereotyped MAMIL with a decidedly low-performance body proportion, which has a much greater effect on how they go on the hills than the bike does.

[DaveQB]

Probably a gearing issue more than anything else but there were a few Venge's in use on and then I'll
Probably a bit of both. The Venge is very hard-nosed aggro race bike aimed at getting as much of the rider's grunt through to the ground as possible, and as such is a pretty uncompromising beast (but you can be damn sure it's nicer to ride than a similarly-profiled aluminium bike!). The Tarmac, while still racing geometry, is more of an all-rounder, and more forgiving as a result. Aero doesn't mean much going up hills. If anything aero often comes with a weight penalty, as usually more material is needed to form the tube shapes. That said, that sector of the bike market does tend to appeal to the stereotyped MAMIL with a decidedly low-performance body proportion, which has a much greater effect on how they go on the hills than the bike does.

What effect would tyres have? A Venge with 28mm tyres vs a "standard" road bike like my Trek or a Tarmac with 23mm tyres? I know tyres have a big impact on comfort, does it overcome the frame stiffness for those long/bumpy rides?

[Duck!]

Well you probably woudn't even get 28s to fit in a Venge for starters! Tyre size does help, if they fit, bit even tyre construction plays a part; a light, supple race tyre will be more forgiving than a hard training/borderline commuting tyre in a given or even larger size.

[DaveQB]

Well you probably woudn't even get 28s to fit in a Venge for starters! Tyre size does help, if they fit, bit even tyre construction plays a part; a light, supple race tyre will be more forgiving than a hard training/borderline commuting tyre in a given or even larger size.

They do. I contacted specialized and they said max 28 for the Venge. Wheel size might play a part. My wheels are 23mm at their widest point. I checked out and took photos of the Reacto and it looks like it would take 28's too.

I've been running latex tubes with cotton tyres lately. Very nice. But a 28mm version of that compared to my 23mm would be noticeable?

[r2160]

Ride down from the edge of the cliff on your new bike!!

The more you like it, the more you ride

Just do it!

[DaveQB]

Ride down from the edge of the cliff on your new bike!!
The more you like it, the more you ride
Just do it!

Or get a mountain bike and ride down the cliff face?

I keep hearing this expression, but if I am being honest, I ride as much as I can. I couldn't fit in more rides with or without a new bike. I wish it was the case though, that's certainly reason enough to buy a new bike in my opinion.

[jerrah]

a light, supple race tyre will be more forgiving than a hard training/borderline commuting tyre in a given or even larger size.

Tell me about it. After a series of destroyed GP4000SII's from glass I'm currently trying 4-Seasons. I was really surprised at how much the road surface is transmitted through the tyres for the same pressure and how much more sluggish the ride has felt.

[outnabike]

Ahh yes, wanting and needing, I know what you mean. I remember a bloke once with a nice Studebaker motor car. That thing ran so sweet.

But the new fords and others came calling on the poor fellows mind and the Studebaker was going out of style.

In the end he put new seat covers in, a wheel cover etc and pointed the door sill Gloss black to match the latest and greatest offerings.
Kept that car for another six years.
So for the trouble, consider a new tape jobby, different pedals, a re oil and shinny new water bottles and keep it.

But crikey that new bike does look good......

[DaveQB]

Ahh yes, wanting and needing, I know what you mean. I remember a bloke once with a nice Studebaker motor car. That thing ran so sweet.

But the new fords and others came calling on the poor fellows mind and the Studebaker was going out of style.

In the end he put new seat covers in, a wheel cover etc and pointed the door sill Gloss black to match the latest and greatest offerings.
Kept that car for another six years.
So for the trouble, consider a new tape jobby, different pedals, a re oil and shinny new water bottles and keep it.

But crikey that new bike does look good......

Haha well said. Problem is, I have new bottle holders, new tape, new handlebar, love my pedals and switched to a brand of oil that's meant to save some watts!

Why not N+1 a time trial bike?

The local Tri shop has the Orbea Ordu m30 TT bike and said they can do it for me (I have become friendly with them) for about $2800. 105 setup, but that's fine for this novice. Reading, the Ordu has a good setup for novice TT riders as it is very adjustable.
I am very tempted.

[DaveQB]

Why not N+1 a time trial bike?

I have thought that. I thought maybe a gravel/comfort bike and a TT bike to cover both ends, but then I thought I could go the Aero bike and use clip-on aerobars to have "2 bikes" out of one....

Trouble is you'll be wanting to change bar/stem position, saddle position, maybe saddle type, etc. Aero bar setup isn't as simple as just bolting on the extensions. Annoying if you want to go for a bunch/hill ride one day and a TT the next. I'm in the same boat but I don't have the luxury of looking at a second bike...

I am going to go this route, MattyK
After having cracked my $200 carbon road handlebars taking my clip-ons off (my carelessness) and then spending over 30mins putting my clip-ons on, on the weekend (it includes some futzing around with stem screws and a mount to allow the Garmin and camera to me attached and then lining up the road handlebars etc), I decided that's enough of that and I am going to go for an entry level TT. [There's too many 'on's in that sentence]
This will allow a dialed in setup for both bikes without having to fiddle every weekend (I often ride on my own on Saturdays and then with others on Sunday.) Plus good to have more than 1 bike so if 1 is off the road, I can still ride (been caught out on that a few times now)

[bychosis]

Cool. Now that is sorted and you found a different cliff to jump off soon, I need talking down from jumping from a small ledge. From 1x9 to 1x11 on my MTB. $290 for the gear from Torpedo 7 seems like a good deal. 1x9 works OK but there are times I'd like an extra gear or two and I'm not going back to a front derailleur.