Pinarello Rokh vs Razha vs Colnago CLX 3.0 vs AC-R

[rockpaper]

Hi all,

Due to a recent accident with my bike I have the opportunity to upgrade- silver lining and all that...
I am looking at Italian bikes.

I mostly do hills (e.g. Victorian Alps) and long rides of several hours, leading up to the Peaks Challenge at Falls Creek next year (13 hours).
So I need a bike that is comfortable for long duration rides and handles roads that are a little bumpy (i.e. comfortable on my spine and arms), as well as good on hills.

I am looking at four bikes (one with disc brakes):
Pinarello Rokh (2013 model) with Ultegra 11-speed
Pinarello Razha (2015 model with Ultegra 11-speed
Colnago CLX 3.0 (2015 model) with either Ultegra 11-speed or Di2
Colnago AC-R (2015 model I think) with Ultegra 11-speed and disc brakes

I might look at the Pinarello FP Team or Unbo, as well.

I have not taken them out for a ride yet but I won’t have the opportunity to try these on serious hills just short duration rides

Does anyone have any thoughts on these bikes for long rides, etc.?
I realise that most people will not have used both brands or all of these bikes but I am sure you would have insight into any particular bike’s worthiness for the type of rides mentioned above.


Thanks in advance

Rockpaper

[bing181]

I have a Rokh, can't say re the other bikes. Razha is basically the same, but with lower-grade carbon. Pinarello FP is a cheaper-carbon version of the Dogma, with a very different geometry. But you probably know all that ...

Re the Rokh. I've had/ridden a number of bikes, and it's by far my preferred. It does that "ride on rails" thing, is the best descender I've ever ridden (including a couple of Colnagos), and for long/very long rides is the bike that leaves me less knocked around. It's comfortable, though it's not a "soft" bike at all, more of a bike with some give, but without losing power - it likes to be pushed and even ridden hard, but you realise when you finish your ride that you just feel fresher. Well, I do! Apart from the comfort, it's a bike that just keeps going, and carries speed well - though you don't mention wheels, tyres etc.

However ... if you want a snappy/nippy bike, it isn't that - though that's probably true of most of the "Granfondo" type bikes. I've done a lot of climbing on it, and it climbs well, but its strengths when climbing are the handling, stability, and comfort. Previously, I had a very nice Look, which was a fabulous and responsive climber - but knocked me round more on longer rides, and on the flat needed a constant "kick along" that the Rokh just doesn't seem to need. I'd just try them all, and see what you think. As always though, check geometry.

[richbee]

The Razha is basically the old Paris mould with 24HM carbon fibre instead of the 50HM that the Paris came with. Still a pretty responsive frame. I've a mate who has one and he's more than happy with the handling and ride quality.
The Rokh differs from the Razha in that the rear triangle is designed for a greater degree of road shock dampening. Derived from the cobbled classics bikes that Sky & Movistar rode (before Movistar switched to Canyon), so should be good of you're planning on riding Strade Bianche or heavily potholed roads, but probably you'd be better off with the Razha for most smooth road rides.
Have you considered something like the Pinarello Gan? Almost the same mould as the Dogma F8 and virtually indistinguishable at a distance, but with T600 carbon fibre a more compliant ride without sacrificing stiffness, and at an affordable price range. My current bike is a Gan RS, and I have nothing but praise for it.

There is one drawback to getting yourself a Pinarello - once you have one you'll never want to ride anything else

[rockpaper]

• Thanks for the detailed replies, bing181 and richbee

@bing181
I’m not the best descender so anything that helps is useful.
i will be putting on my Mavic Ksyrium (one up from the stock aksium’s) with Yksion Comp tyres.
probably more after something for long rides and climbing, with more comfort than super snappy responsiveness; I’m no boy racer and just want to feel comfortable with descents and know I can go for a while feeling good at the end of it.
Also, that the bike gives me the feeling of just wanting to get out and ride, something my current bike did not do.

It sounds like the rokh might be the way to go, maybe even the razha.
I will be test riding them all so might get some idea, although living in Melbourne means very little in the way of hills for a test ride.

@richbee
I had not considered pinarello until I rode in Italy in the Sellaronda Bike Day and there were a LOT of pinarello’s around (mostly passing me…), especially a lot of Princes
I like the colour scheme on the razha (I’m so shallow), as well as the internal cabling, whilst the rokh on offer has external cabling but still looks good. Internal vs External cabling Is not a deal breaker but just external cabling doesn’t look as good.
Realistically, the roads in the VIC alps are generally smooth with some roughness but not heavily scarred or pockmarked.

So, I saw a Gan RS in Italy and wanted it right away…I preferred the more standard fork design than the odd wavy one on the usual pinarellos.
Not sure the Gan RS is affordable but that is subjective… 
What do you think of the Gan S vs Gan RS?

As for its providing a compliant ride: what are your thoughts on century rides or longer? I am sure climbing will be fine…

Cheers,
Rockpaper

[rockpaper]

i am also trying to source a Dedacciai frame and build it up myself (or maybe a Bottecchia).
no one in the UK send to Australia and it is hard to find other sellers in other counries.
why dedacciai? rarity value and they look good.

[richbee]

So, I saw a Gan RS in Italy and wanted it right away…I preferred the more standard fork design than the odd wavy one on the usual pinarellos.
Not sure the Gan RS is affordable but that is subjective… 
What do you think of the Gan S vs Gan RS?

As for its providing a compliant ride: what are your thoughts on century rides or longer? I am sure climbing will be fine…

Affordability is subjective. I wen't with the RS because it had the best colour scheme - yes I am that fickle.

The difference between Gan RS and theGan S is in the grade of carbon fibre used. RS uses T900, S T700. The bottom end Gan has T600 carbon fibre, still good, Giant use it on their Defy range. Finish varies with the RS fitted with Ultegra Di2, the S generally with Ultegra mechanical, and the Gan with 105.
Standard RS will set you back about $7200 - though specials on 2016 range will probably be around for less as the 2017 bikes are hitting the shops about now. You should be able to get an S for a smidgen over $5k, while I've no idea about the base Gan price.

On the RS, I'm regularly riding 3 hour and longer rides without getting unduly fatigued (except due to my own lack of form). I'd be happy to recommend it for longer rides as the ride is very comfortable. Bikes come with a Fizik Arione saddle which is OK, but more suited to edgy racing than gran fondo style rides. I've put an Astute saddle on mine, but that's a personal choice and it's best to try different saddles to see what works best for you.

Best thing about it, it rewards the effort you put in. I love mine.

[AndrewCowley]

The Gan RS looks great. A couple of things stick out though.

The geometry is aggressive. Not that different to the Dogma F8. May not suit everyone.

The non standard seat post is a worry. What if you need to swap it out for a zero setback post?

[richbee]

The Gan RS looks great. A couple of things stick out though.

The geometry is aggressive. Not that different to the Dogma F8. May not suit everyone.

The non standard seat post is a worry. What if you need to swap it out for a zero setback post?

Geometry is similar to but not the same as the F8. I can assure you it's a beautiful bike to ride, comfortable and rewarding. More so than the Paris I had previously. This is not a bike for Audax or touring with panniers - get yourself a Thorn if that's what you want to do, the Gan is a gran fondo bike that is just as happy on the crit track.

If you need a zero setback seatpost then you've got the wrong size frame.

[rockpaper]

@richbee:
thanks for the follow up on the Gan models. unfortunately, the Gan models are out of my price range, although the RS I saw in italy was the nice green/yellow + black model and looked very attractive. If I could afford it I might buy it just for that. Based on your comments about ride quality and on suitability (or not) for the Audax-style rides then i might have to pass. still, your other recommendations about Pinarello are welcome and I am looking forward to trying some out.

@AndrewCowley:
Thanks for the reply. I admit I do not know too much about geometry of bikes and their suitability for different styles of riding but your post has made me start some google searches and research...