$1000 Import Threshold 2017 Idiotion

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Re: $1000 Import Threshold 2017 Idiotion

Postby AUbicycles » Thu Jun 01, 2017 4:48 pm

Thanks for the links - here are the key topics for the Wiggle submission
1. The time frame between the law being passed and its effect is too short.
Inability to technically update systems in time for July 1
2. Orders of $1,000 will be subject to delay, fees, complexity and potential double payment of GST.
Big overseas retailers have very fast logistics (at least before the local delivery companies get their hands onto the goods). But generally this is a competitive advantage for them as Australian online retailers have been significantly slower in the past and only in the last two years are the leading Australian online retailers committing to speedy processing and delivery.

Wiggle also pinpoint a very valid concern that items may have had GST levied but when they are processed by custom then this can't easily be documented and there is a chance that GST is levied a second time.
3. Smaller competitors using postal services may not apply GST.
Wiggle say that the law targets big companies with 'commercial cargo paperwork' while smaller companies who use postal services can slip past even when they sell in excess of $75,000


--

For Wiggle, the Australian market is important and in the submissions I notice a lot of submissions by freight companies. I peaked into one and their issue is being involved in the collection or have a responsibility for documenting so essentially want to be excluded.

DHL noted
DHL endorses the recommendations of previous Government-appointed bodies, including the Productivity Commission and Low Value Parcel Processing Taskforce, which found that the cost of GST collection at the border (upon arrival) would exceed any GST revenue gained, resulting in a net welfare cost.
--

The end result however is that this restricts both consumer and business access to goods because overseas companies will find it harder to comply.

It is already common for overseas retailers to block Australians from purchasing certain items. You could argue that this gives larger and established Australian businesses a better opportunity to be the single supplier - but limiting competition or forcing customers to purchase from one, or a limited range of suppliers or retailers is also manipulating the market.
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Ross
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Re: $1000 Import Threshold 2017 Idiotion

Postby Ross » Sat Jun 03, 2017 10:01 am

Not personally in favour of the GST being introduced on all imported items but it happens in other countries I believe such as UK, so how do they do it without all the hand-wringing?

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Re: $1000 Import Threshold 2017 Idiotion

Postby AUbicycles » Tue Jun 06, 2017 6:08 am

The EU has trade agreements so it became a formality. A complicated part of it is that there are different tax rates for different goods. For online shops they set the rate for each item (which is easier to do gradually / over time than suddenly) then collect at the time of transaction and then rather than directly settling the tax accounts - it is part of the accounting so they pay tax locally and the governments regulate it.

Australia puts the onus on each overseas online retailer (with $75K + sales) to deal with Australian bureaucracy and taxation directly and this limits consumer access and choice:
• Big overseas retailers will go through the process - it may have some effect on pricing and being competitive but they have an advantage over smaller online retailers.
• Smaller overseas online retailers will either reject / ignore Australian sales (too hard) or will go for work-arounds (as Wiggle has suggested) but generally the bureaucracy makes it harder to complete.

Because it will cost more that it earns, it is essentially a government subsidy that screws with the system. A survey we did eons ago on this forum however showed that added GST would not affect consumer behaviour - particularly if the price is 50% less overseas. However over the years, local online Australian bike shops have become more competitive and in comparison have a greater market share (though total online sales volume is also increasing). But this taxation was also for the traditional bricks and mortar retailers who, however, wont see the type of direct advantage which they hope (or have been lead to believe).
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Re: $1000 Import Threshold 2017 Idiotion

Postby Top_Bhoy » Wed Jun 07, 2017 6:28 pm

AUbicycles wrote:However over the years, local online Australian bike shops have become more competitive and in comparison have a greater market share (though total online sales volume is also increasing). But this taxation was also for the traditional bricks and mortar retailers who, however, wont see the type of direct advantage which they hope (or have been lead to believe).
Very true, price is only part of the consumer equation. I use overseas retailers not only for price but because I want to buy a particular model/brand of my choosing and not because a distributor has decided I am allowed only limited access to the manufacturers wider range.

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Re: $1000 Import Threshold 2017 Idiotion

Postby MickMelb » Tue Jun 20, 2017 12:44 pm

12 months delay to Start of new GST Import Threshold

This was a news item last night...turns out Ebay/Amazon/Alibaba have forced a years delay to July 2018. Not yet voted through both houses but looks likely apparently.


http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-06-19/o ... ys/8632268

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Re: $1000 Import Threshold 2017 Idiotion

Postby OnTrackZeD » Tue Jun 20, 2017 1:31 pm

MickMelb wrote:12 months delay to Start of new GST Import Threshold
Yep I heard it on the radio this morning as well.

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Re: $1000 Import Threshold 2017 Idiotion

Postby cancan64 » Thu Jun 22, 2017 12:43 pm

I just recieved an email from my Spot tracker service provider in USA:

'Under legislation of New Zealand Inland Revenue, we are required to collect and remit GST from New Zealand resident consumers not registered for GST. '

I am charged US taxes so would be a pain to pay both, fortunately I am GST registered and spot tracker is purely for work, not cycling
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Re: $1000 Import Threshold 2017 Idiotion

Postby panosk » Wed Jul 12, 2017 12:44 am

So, has anyone experienced the new situation ?
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Re: $1000 Import Threshold 2017 Idiotion

Postby RobertL » Wed Jul 12, 2017 10:24 am

panosk wrote:So, has anyone experienced the new situation ?
No - it has been delayed 12 months until 1 July 2018.

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Re: $1000 Import Threshold 2017 Idiotion

Postby Cheesewheel » Thu Mar 22, 2018 2:24 pm

THE cost of online shopping could be about to rise dramatically thanks to a new government proposal.

The Department of Home Affairs proposal would see a $5 tax imposed on every package containing items worth less than $1000 sent from overseas.

http://www.news.com.au/finance/business ... 185fded51c

(/Runs to mobile phone and gets busy on alienexpress as online shopping FOMO moves into 4th gear)
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Re: $1000 Import Threshold 2017 Idiotion

Postby Mububban » Thu Mar 22, 2018 3:24 pm

Will the $1000 threshold affect single items of $1000 or more (such as frames or wheelsets), or total combined orders adding up to $1000 or more?
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Re: $1000 Import Threshold 2017 Idiotion

Postby queequeg » Thu Mar 22, 2018 3:28 pm

Cheesewheel wrote:THE cost of online shopping could be about to rise dramatically thanks to a new government proposal.

The Department of Home Affairs proposal would see a $5 tax imposed on every package containing items worth less than $1000 sent from overseas.

http://www.news.com.au/finance/business ... 185fded51c

(/Runs to mobile phone and gets busy on alienexpress as online shopping FOMO moves into 4th gear)
In a way, the $5 tax could be a bonus, as customs processing charges on items over the threshold is something like $90. So, once they remove the $1000 threshold, do you really want a $90 charge on your $2 widget? I don't think customs could possibly keep up with the volume of parcels coming in.

Presumably this is also to catch a lot of the pointless collection of GST on items not worth the time, though I do wonder how they will collect the $5 tax on the millions of packages coming into the country without requiring massive amounts of storage while they chase people for payment
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Re: $1000 Import Threshold 2017 Idiotion

Postby queequeg » Thu Mar 22, 2018 3:29 pm

Mububban wrote:Will the $1000 threshold affect single items of $1000 or more (such as frames or wheelsets), or total combined orders adding up to $1000 or more?
I'd guess it is on single items, as anything over the $1000 would presumably cop the current full customs processing charge.

It may not be a bad thing having this small processing charge, as customs could well slug you the $90 on your $5 item right once the GST free threshold drops to $0 on July 1st
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Re: $1000 Import Threshold 2017 Idiotion

Postby Thoglette » Thu Mar 22, 2018 7:37 pm

There is an issue of certain countries "gaming" the postal system - e.g. getting an item from China to anywhere in .au for less than the cost of postage between SYD and MEL.

The govt. can't slap a $7.50 Aust Post levy on international items but they can put a $7.50 "handling" fee on them. That'll help level the field a bit.

Again, I just don't understand why they don't have the banks collect the GST and fees when money goes into a non-ABN account. It's so easy, particularly now while the banks are doing their mea cuplas
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Re: $1000 Import Threshold 2017 Idiotion

Postby Ross » Thu Mar 22, 2018 8:02 pm

eBay hits back at $5 parcel tax proposal

http://www.canberratimes.com.au/federal ... 4z5o4.html

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Re: $1000 Import Threshold 2017 Idiotion

Postby Ross » Thu Mar 22, 2018 8:07 pm

So what happens if we order something worth $2 from say China and we "forget" there is a $5 processing fe and so decide we don't want it anymore? Who is going to pay to send it back to China and who is going to want it? Not the original Chinese supplier as it will cost them import duties that will be more than the value of the item.

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Re: $1000 Import Threshold 2017 Idiotion

Postby Thoglette » Fri Mar 23, 2018 12:46 am

Ross wrote:and we "forget" there is a $5 processing fee and so decide we don't want it anymore? Who is going to pay ..
Simple. You.

If you don't pay on time you lose the goods and the fee goes up to cover admin costs.

Customs and Quarantine are like that.
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Re: $1000 Import Threshold 2017 Idiotion

Postby bychosis » Fri Mar 23, 2018 6:58 am

The $5 processing fee sounds easier to collect than the GST. Just add it onto postage.
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Re: $1000 Import Threshold 2017 Idiotion

Postby Ross » Fri Mar 23, 2018 1:02 pm

Thoglette wrote:
Ross wrote:and we "forget" there is a $5 processing fee and so decide we don't want it anymore? Who is going to pay ..
Simple. You.

If you don't pay on time you lose the goods and the fee goes up to cover admin costs.

Customs and Quarantine are like that.
But I haven't taken delivery of it. So they (govco?) will keep sending payment notices for how long? A month, 2 months, 6 months, a year, more? So if I don't pay up will I eventually go to court and possibly jail, just over a misunderstanding regarding a $2 widget? I'm certainly not going to purchase one from Harvey Norman instead for $20 (supposing they even sell one which is unlikely).

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Re: $1000 Import Threshold 2017 Idiotion

Postby MichaelB » Fri Mar 23, 2018 2:37 pm

bychosis wrote:The $5 processing fee sounds easier to collect than the GST. Just add it onto postage.
That's how I think it would work.

My non-coding brain says that when you select "Aus" for delivery, there is a fee attached and you pay at the checkout. The $$ collected then gets sent on to the Govmint to be frittered away on 'stuff'

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Re: $1000 Import Threshold 2017 Idiotion

Postby Thoglette » Fri Mar 23, 2018 3:52 pm

Ross wrote:So if I don't pay up will I eventually go to court and possibly jail, just over a misunderstanding regarding a $2 widget?
Something like that. Just hope that they don't outsource colelction to the mob who do road tolls
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Re: $1000 Import Threshold 2017 Idiotion

Postby Jawa » Fri Mar 23, 2018 4:26 pm

Ross wrote:So what happens if we order something worth $2 from say China and we "forget" there is a $5 processing fe and so decide we don't want it anymore? Who is going to pay to send it back to China and who is going to want it? Not the original Chinese supplier as it will cost them import duties that will be more than the value of the item.
There's a part of me that would be willing to drop a hundred bucks every now and then. Order say a hundred separate items from overseas then when Aust Post come calling for the fees just tell them to shove it and sat I dont want it. Just waste their time of purpose

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Re: $1000 Import Threshold 2017 Idiotion

Postby Mububban » Sat Mar 24, 2018 8:18 am

$1100 total order from c r c, just got this payment request:

Image
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Re: $1000 Import Threshold 2017 Idiotion

Postby queequeg » Sat Mar 24, 2018 3:07 pm

Mububban wrote:$1100 total order from c r c, just got this payment request:

Image
As per your other post, it's always a risk when you go close to the $1000 limit. Also need to factor in that the threshold includes the shipping costs, not just the cost of the items. The closest I have been willing to push it is around $900. If you are going to go over, make sure you go over by enough that the $100 slug for customs charges doesn't hurt you, as it has here.

Does make me wonder, in July when the $1000 threshold goes, will customs be sending out millions of these payment requests with $100 of "Other Levys" for low value items. Ordering that $10 book from Book Depository might suddenly become a big issue.
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Re: $1000 Import Threshold 2017 Idiotion

Postby AUbicycles » Mon Mar 26, 2018 4:04 pm

I have an interview soon with the ATO to be published on BNA to share answers.

There is no processing fee, so an eligible dealer just adds and collects GST. If there is an added transaction fee by the retailer, is is probably frustration as they have added admin for GST compliance so it is to cover there overheads and probably penny pincing.

Overseas retailers under $75K in sales to Australia don’t have to add / collect GST so this would be legally GST free.
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