Smart trainers and software

[g-boaf]

Just got an email from Zwift.
Subscription is going up from $21.99 a month to 29.99 from next month.
Will need to investigate an alternative pretty quickly.
It will need to be able to run using my mobile phone as a wifi hotspot. The town where I use it only has 4g network. Any ideas?
Are Rouvy and Fulgaz data hungry because they use real world filmed segments?

Probably data hungry, they download quite huge video files. You'd chew up your data rate, but at least someone other than Zwift will get your money.

[warthog1]

Just got an email from Zwift.
Subscription is going up from $21.99 a month to 29.99 from next month.
Will need to investigate an alternative pretty quickly.
It will need to be able to run using my mobile phone as a wifi hotspot. The town where I use it only has 4g network. Any ideas?
Are Rouvy and Fulgaz data hungry because they use real world filmed segments?

Probably data hungry, they download quite huge video files. You'd chew up your data rate, but at least you someone other than Zwift will get your money.

I have terrabytes of rolled over data, so that is not an issue. Functionality is. May have to just try it.

[g-boaf]

Fulgaz is okay, but it's not as interactive as Zwift. Each has its benefits.

There are regular people I ride with on Zwift, that's a motivation when I sometimes couldn't be bothered riding. They don't use Fulgaz. And most Fulgaz routes, you do the big mountain and at the top, that is it. Another lap? You start again from the bottom.

[warthog1]

Fulgaz is okay, but it's not as interactive as Zwift. Each has its benefits.

Thanks GB. I dont communicate or choose to ride with anyone on Zwift. It is just a workout when I can't otherwise ride.
I use it when on call so need it to load and start quickly. Can't be sitting there for 20 minutescwaiting for it to load. It is half the price so that is good but it needs to function.

[warthog1]

what do you reckon of this GB?

To reliably stream FulGaz rides you will need a sustained internet speed of double the bitrate of the video file. For each of the three quality settings, this works out to roughly:

4K = 40 Mbit/s
1080p = 12 Mbit/s
720p = 8 Mbit/s


https://support.fulgaz.com/hc/en-us/art ... 20Mbit%2Fs

https://support.fulgaz.com/hc/en-us/art ... lity-video

I should be able to view it in 1080p on 4g?

[g-boaf]

it depends on what your 4G is like and how congested the network is. In my suburban area of Sydney the 4G/5G can be very unreliable.

I would suggest stay with Zwift, it is familiar to you and it works reliably.

[warthog1]

it depends on what your 4G is like and how congested the network is. In my suburban area of Sydney the 4G/5G can be very unreliable.

I would suggest stay with Zwift, it is familiar to you and it works reliably.

I'll give it a go up there and see how it goes.
Zwift have just pis sed me off with a 25% price rise.

[warthog1]

It aint popular https://forums.zwift.com/t/changes-to-z ... 629931/349
Plenty leaving it seems. Me too I think.

[foo on patrol]

There are free trials for Rouvy and Fulgaz, so try one at a time and see what you want. I have a bloke on my GOFAR page that trialed the Fulgaz and is telling Swift to go have sex with themselves over the price hike.

Foo

[g-boaf]

It aint popular https://forums.zwift.com/t/changes-to-z ... 629931/349
Plenty leaving it seems. Me too I think.

Ah, plenty who are also probably spending stacks of money on some expensive bike or parts. Yet a small increase on Zwift? Heaven forbid!

They will come back I’m sure, especially with the new routes coming soon. And it’s the summer coming for a lot of them so they pause their accounts anyway.

I had also thought of moving completely over to Fulgaz but while it has some things I like, it doesn’t do everything. So I’m keeping both.

My fitness is worth a few extra dollars.

[foo on patrol]

I just got a message from a mate and he suggested this one. He said that he and his wife had started out using the the free version and now on the paid (AT) $48 a year. His wife does Tri's and he does the occassional road race now and recons that other than the higher intensity graphics of the swift, it works very well with plenty of structured workouts in it, so me being a "retired person, will try and setup Volt and ride package.

https://trainerday.com/

Foo

[warthog1]

It aint popular https://forums.zwift.com/t/changes-to-z ... 629931/349
Plenty leaving it seems. Me too I think.

Ah, plenty who are also probably spending stacks of money on some expensive bike or parts. Yet a small increase on Zwift? Heaven forbid!

They will come back I’m sure, especially with the new routes coming soon. And it’s the summer coming for a lot of them so they pause their accounts anyway.

I had also thought of moving completely over to Fulgaz but while it has some things I like, it doesn’t do everything. So I’m keeping both.

My fitness is worth a few extra dollars.

It isn't a small rise. It is a greater than 25% rise.
I take your point about equipment expenses, even my humble set up is 1.5k using an old bike.
That much of a price hike annoys me and Zwift has gotten old anyway.
Dunno. I will see what works.

[warthog1]

I just got a message from a mate and he suggested this one. He said that he and his wife had started out using the the free version and now on the paid (AT) $48 a year. His wife does Tri's and he does the occassional road race now and recons that other than the higher intensity graphics of the swift, it works very well with plenty of structured workouts in it, so me being a "retired person, will try and setup Volt and ride package.

https://trainerday.com/

Foo

That sounds good Foo. $48 a year is cheaper than 2 months of Zwift.

[jasonc]

It aint popular https://forums.zwift.com/t/changes-to-z ... 629931/349
Plenty leaving it seems. Me too I think.

Ah, plenty who are also probably spending stacks of money on some expensive bike or parts. Yet a small increase on Zwift? Heaven forbid!

They will come back I’m sure, especially with the new routes coming soon. And it’s the summer coming for a lot of them so they pause their accounts anyway.

I had also thought of moving completely over to Fulgaz but while it has some things I like, it doesn’t do everything. So I’m keeping both.

My fitness is worth a few extra dollars.

It isn't a small rise. It is a greater than 25% rise.
I take your point about equipment expenses, even my humble set up is 1.5k using an old bike.
That much of a price hike annoys me and Zwift has gotten old anyway.
Dunno. I will see what works.

after a price rise last year which they seem to be ignoring

[warthog1]

Yes they are taking the pi ss a bit it seems to me.

[warthog1]

Had a go at FulGaz today. I like it. Prefer real scenery than computer generated stuff.
You ride alone but I care not. I don't interact with others on Zwift anyway.
Had my AppleTV box set to 1080p and that was fine. I am able to watch MotoGP on the AppleTV using my phone as a hotspot at the work accomodation so I think it will work. My lord it showed just ĥow ridiculously fake the zwift kms are. I have trainer climb difficulty set to 100% but it is far too generous with speed overall and the drafting is ridiculous in that it gives you free speed unrealisticly. The kms on there rack up far more quickly than they do in real life. FulGaz is much closer to real riding time/distance from my brief impression of it.
Just over half the price of Zwift. Pretty sure Zwift is a goner for me.

Moreover with so many more users I fail to see why Zwift need to charge so much more and how it is justified.

[g-boaf]

My lord it showed just ĥow ridiculously fake the zwift kms are. I have trainer climb difficulty set to 100% but it is far too generous with speed overall and the drafting is ridiculous in that it gives you free speed unrealisticly. The kms on there rack up far more quickly than they do in real life.

Zwift is built for a certain type and everything is just about pancake flat for the sit-in and sprint crowd. The moment you suggest hills for a robopacer ride they all start complaining and whinging.

On Fulgaz I only ever do the mountainous routes, I never ever go anywhere near the flat ones because I suppose those will be equally fake.

At least I can compare those mountainous routes because a lot of them I've ridden IRL.


Zwift's problem was the disastrous hardware efforts they tried, the trainer bike that never went to market being one of the major ones. You do all that effort to come up with a problem and then don't release it.

[warthog1]

My lord it showed just ĥow ridiculously fake the zwift kms are. I have trainer climb difficulty set to 100% but it is far too generous with speed overall and the drafting is ridiculous in that it gives you free speed unrealisticly. The kms on there rack up far more quickly than they do in real life.

Zwift is built for a certain type and everything is just about pancake flat for the sit-in and sprint crowd. The moment you suggest hills for a robopacer ride they all start complaining and whinging.

On Fulgaz I only ever do the mountainous routes, I never ever go anywhere near the flat ones because I suppose those will be equally fake.

At least I can compare those mountainous routes because a lot of them I've ridden IRL.


Zwift's problem was the disastrous hardware efforts they tried, the trainer bike that never went to market being one of the major ones. You do all that effort to come up with a problem and then don't release it.

I've only done a couple of rides but the flat seemed slower than it is on Zwift. Maybe because there were no other riders and no drafting?
Yikes the riding at intersections on one of the filmed rides I went on! Ploughing through stop signs and pulling into the lane in front of cars. Clearly not filmed in Australia as you'd be abused and run over here if you did that.

Zwift must need a finance manager or something. Thousands of users at $300+ a year. Multi millions of income.

[g-boaf]

My lord it showed just ĥow ridiculously fake the zwift kms are. I have trainer climb difficulty set to 100% but it is far too generous with speed overall and the drafting is ridiculous in that it gives you free speed unrealisticly. The kms on there rack up far more quickly than they do in real life.

Zwift is built for a certain type and everything is just about pancake flat for the sit-in and sprint crowd. The moment you suggest hills for a robopacer ride they all start complaining and whinging.

On Fulgaz I only ever do the mountainous routes, I never ever go anywhere near the flat ones because I suppose those will be equally fake.

At least I can compare those mountainous routes because a lot of them I've ridden IRL.


Zwift's problem was the disastrous hardware efforts they tried, the trainer bike that never went to market being one of the major ones. You do all that effort to come up with a problem and then don't release it.

I've only done a couple of rides but the flat seemed slower than it is on Zwift. Maybe because there were no other riders and no drafting?
Yikes the riding at intersections on one of the filmed rides I went on! Ploughing through stop signs and pulling into the lane in front of cars. Clearly not filmed in Australia as you'd be abused and run over here if you did that.

Zwift must need a finance manager or something. Thousands of users at $300+ a year. Multi millions of income.

True, no other riders and no drafting. No 200-400 rider mega-groups in Fulgaz.

On Fulgaz, stick to the mountain routes in France and you'll be happy - that's what it does best.

[warthog1]

True, no other riders and no drafting. No 200-400 rider mega-groups in Fulgaz.

On Fulgaz, stick to the mountain routes in France and you'll be happy - that's what it does best.

Prob not what I do best nowhere near as well as you anyway but the only way I'm going to ride them ànytime soon.

[Mr Purple]

On Fulgaz I only ever do the mountainous routes, I never ever go anywhere near the flat ones because I suppose those will be equally fake.

At least I can compare those mountainous routes because a lot of them I've ridden IRL.

I find I need at least a few hundred metres elevation on a Fulgaz ride to actually get through it. It's realistic but simply too boring otherwise. I notice someone's filmed a Tourmalet descent in the recent lot, which seems absolutely pointless.

Speaking of which one of the frequent contributors recently used me in his definition of an 'uncomfortable kicker' versus a 'rolling' ride. Apparently if I hold the KOM it's an 'uncomfortable kicker'. Good to know!

[LateStarter]

I have never been big with any of the sites as I don't have Wi-Fi in my garage where the trainer is (under my apartment building 10 floors below my unit) and the phone reception is pretty bad too. I looked at the Fulgaz intro video which had a videoed in Australia bit including a yellow Porsche doing a u-turn in front of the approaching (motor?) bike, very Australian. If I could figure out how to get enough bandwidth to view a video I could get to like it perhaps, is the "reactive" mode realistic? I do most bigger real rides on my own all day anyway so that's not an issue

[jasonc]

I have never been big with any of the sites as I don't have Wi-Fi in my garage where the trainer is

And here's me on the other end of the scale - I've just had 2 ethernet ports installed in my garage so I don't need to use wifi (next on the list is a wahoo ethernet connection box)

[Mr Purple]

I have never been big with any of the sites as I don't have Wi-Fi in my garage where the trainer is (under my apartment building 10 floors below my unit) and the phone reception is pretty bad too. I looked at the Fulgaz intro video which had a videoed in Australia bit including a yellow Porsche doing a u-turn in front of the approaching (motor?) bike, very Australian. If I could figure out how to get enough bandwidth to view a video I could get to like it perhaps, is the "reactive" mode realistic? I do most bigger real rides on my own all day anyway so that's not an issue

Yes. The reactive mode is very realistic in most cases. As I've filmed a couple of rides I've had to test ride them and the feel and the time is often very similar to how I did it in real life.

One of the problems is that you are still subjected to the standards of the local driving, although at least you'll never actually get hit! Because the reactive mode lets you go twice as fast as the original ride if you can manage the power, sometimes the cars come past twice as fast as they did in real life, which often gives you a bit of a shock. Probably the worst part is when you're on a climb that was filmed particularly slowly and a mountain biker comes flying past despite the fact you're putting down 400W at the time. In that way I suppose it's like e-bikes in the real world.

[g-boaf]

One of the problems is that you are still subjected to the standards of the local driving, although at least you'll never actually get hit! Because the reactive mode lets you go twice as fast as the original ride if you can manage the power, sometimes the cars come past twice as fast as they did in real life, which often gives you a bit of a shock. Probably the worst part is when you're on a climb that was filmed particularly slowly and a mountain biker comes flying past despite the fact you're putting down 400W at the time. In that way I suppose it's like e-bikes in the real world.

Oh yes, the campers on very narrow climbs.

Had a few close passes from those, nothing malicious, just a bit silly.